Trump 2024 ???

[Ziggidy]

but Jamil is wiping the floor with you here, just take the loss on this one.

It all comes down to opinion. What each of us determines is important. What may be morally acceptable is where this thread has gone; and that’s ok.

 

[bwframe]

It all comes down to opinion...

 

[DragonGunner]

Ok…Boooooo!!! God forbid he attacks democrats, Fauci and the media. Then talks about faith. But I love it, shows who the real traitors are.

 

[jamil]

If there's any floor wiping going on, jamil is doing it with the belly of his shirt while still wearing it

More teal ********.

He just admitted that DeSantis made his Disney problems worse with unforced errors but he also holds Trump unacceptable as a leader because he makes unforced errors. DeSantis is supposed to lack the flaws in Trump's personality but I'm not seeing much evidence for that viewpoint, and the longer he campaigns at the national level, the worse he gets

If I hold Trump as an unacceptable leader then I could not vote for him under any circumstances. I just said that morality figures into the equation too. Trump makes unforced errors too often to count. His unforced errors led to the trouble he's in now. Think of the NY prosecutor and the law he had to contort just to make charges that stem from Trump ****ing the porn star. Don't **** porn stars, and you won't have to pay them for their silence when you run for office, and then your accountants won't put numbers in wrong columns, and then there's no technicality that dishonest prosecutors can get you on. Without that, just think of the even more ludicrous charge the ******* would have to concoct.

In my viewpoint, DeSantis made a mistake with Disney. If he didn't want Disney to have the sweetheart deal they have, he should have worked to end it. But he didn't give a **** until he could use it to punish them for saying stuff he didn't like. That kicked DeSantis's scorecard down considerably. He also lost points for the "God sent me" ad. But to me, comparing score cards, Trump's still behind, because he has way more unforced errors on his public record.

What I've said about Trump is that he's not the guy who can turn things around. He shoots himself in the dick too much which robs himself of future successes. I don't know that DeSantis is either. Maybe neither of them are. Maybe the person we need doesn't exist. In May I'll pick the one who I think is best suited. In November, I'll vote for whichever one runs against the party of Clown World. That's where I'm at.

I'll take the guy creating the draft over the guy trying to run the race drafting

That's your choice. I'll make mine. I don't know why that makes you **** teal so much.

 

[bwframe]

Ok…Boooooo!!! God forbid he attacks democrats, Fauci and the media. Then talks about faith. But I love it, shows who the real traitors are.

Glad to see him confirm that he is a real POS.

 

[jamil]

You’re making assumptions that all pandemics will react the same, or similar to the covid “pandemic”. We never faced this before and did what we could, thought was right. We cannot truly claim the end results would have been the same if we did not lock down; could you?

It was an unknown situation we were faced with. It is happens again will the same actions help or hinder? Can you truly claim we should never lockdown again based on the comic actions?

Trump did what he thought was correct, and maybe it was. How can you deny or prove his actions did not save lives?

My support for Trump is not based on his reaction to covid nor is it based on how he feels he did there. My support for Trump is strictly based on the fact that we do not have anyone better at the moment. You’re claiming facts. The only fact you can prove is that Trump believes he did a great job with the covid “pandemic”. I cannot prove or disprove that.

The next “pandemic” may prove isolation is the right thing to do?

WTF? You're so devoted to Trump that you think he saved people with the lockdowns? How many people died because of them? How many people couldn't get the medical care they needed because of the lockdowns? All those countries that locked down even harder than the US eventually had worse outcomes.

I'm just taken aback with disbelief that one could hold such a position. Trump claimed he saved lives and your devotion to him is so strong that you have to believe he's saying the truth because he can't be wrong.

I'm not asking you to dump Trump because of his inability to admit fault. It's a problem. It does not disqualify him if you think his other traits make him the best choice. It doesn't mean I won't vote for him in 2024 if he's the nominee. It's a flaw I wish he would correct. This is what normal people do. They detect faults even in people they admire, and they at least want them to correct the flaw.

 

[jamil]

Meh. Still a Fat Ass Pussbag.

 

[jamil]

It all comes down to opinion. What each of us determines is important. What may be morally acceptable is where this thread has gone; and that’s ok.

I completely agree with this. As much as you might think so right now, we're not enemies. I'll criticize any leader where I think they fall short. As I said, anyone who wants to rule needs to be scrutinized, not idolized. That's my worldview.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

How many people died because of them?

My mom did. I will never be convinced otherwise. But I don't know if that was Trump's or Holcomb's doing. I suspect that most of that goes to Holcomb.

 

[jamil]

My mom did. I will never be convinced otherwise. But I don't know if that was Trump's or Holcomb's doing. I suspect that most of that goes to Holcomb.

Nah, I think ultimately it was Fauci et al. And like I said, I don't think Trump deserves blame for those decisions he made, per se. He couldn't have known any better. But at Fauci's recommendation, the US official policy was to lock down. The fed can't lock down states, so state governments had to act.

Because it was the officially recommended US policy, I can't even blame a spineless turd like Holcomb for the initial decision. But, as it became more apparent that there was a strong political component to this, Holcomb should have said, "**** that". Trump should have said, "**** that".

My complaint has been that given the current information available, we now know better now. Yet Trump is still claiming credit. If he's claiming credit at this point for lives saved, that logically includes claiming the blame for lives lost. I don't think he deserved blame for the lockdowns apart from that. But if he's so eager to claim it...

 

[jamil]

Oh. And my FIL died during that time as well. He had some complications from a disease he had that they would not treat unless he had covid. He ended up in the emergency room eventually. Didn't have covid. But he died alone because visitors weren't allowed.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Nah, I think ultimately it was Fauci et al. And like I said, I don't think Trump deserves blame for those decisions he made, per se. He couldn't have known any better. But at Fauci's recommendation, the US official policy was to lock down. The fed can't lock down states, so state governments had to act.

Because it was the officially recommended US policy, I can't even blame a spineless turd like Holcomb for the initial decision. But, as it became more apparent that there was a strong political component to this, Holcomb should have said, "**** that". Trump should have said, "**** that".

My complaint has been that given the current information available, we now know better now. Yet Trump is still claiming credit. If he's claiming credit at this point for lives saved, that logically includes claiming the blame for lives lost. I don't think he deserved blame for the lockdowns apart from that. But if he's so eager to claim it...

Fauci can FATWO too, but it was Holcomb that kept extending the lockdowns long after they were known to be ineffective. By that time, Trump had left it up to the states.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Oh. And my FIL died during that time as well. He had some complications from a disease he had that they would not treat unless he had covid. He ended up in the emergency room eventually. Didn't have covid. But he died alone because visitors weren't allowed.

Mom was in reasonably good health. She was in assisted living and was very much a "social butterfly", participating in all the activities, having visitors, etc.. My sister and I both saw her rapid decline when she was forced to stay in her apartment and no longer interact with her friends and the other residents.

 

[jamil]

Fauci can FATWO too, but it was Holcomb that kept extending the lockdowns long after they were known to be ineffective. By that time, Trump had left it up to the states.

It was always left up to the states. The fed doesn't have the power to lock states down. About all they can do is shut down DC and the federal government.

But yeah, after it became apparent that the lockdowns were ********, Holcomb should have ended the emergency order.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

It was always left up to the states.

So why is everyone blaming Trump?

 

[KG1]

I completely agree with this. As much as you might think so right now, we're not enemies. I'll criticize any leader where I think they fall short. As I said, anyone who wants to rule needs to be scrutinized, not idolized. That's my worldview.

Maybe if the MSM and others scrutinized everyone equally we wouldn't be in the political mess we're in today of having to choose the least ****ty option. More scrutiny demands better standards.

 

[Onebad06vtx]

So why is everyone blaming Trump?

Times like this,you find out who really voted for Biden.
And they will again!

 

[jamil]

Maybe if the MSM scrutinized everyone equally we wouldn't be in the political mess we're in today of having to choose the least ****ty option. More scrutiny demands better standards.

We don't need MSM. We can learn facts and scrutinize decisions on our own. But, yes. People consume their trusted news sources, and it's filled their heads full of ****. And that tends to inhibit their ability to think for themselves. Media has told us that Justice has held the powerful to account by charging Hunter Biden, and then cut a plea deal to give him a disproportionate consequence from what normal citizens would get.

 

[BugI02]

So why is everyone blaming Trump?

Ding, Ding, Ding!

 

[jamil]

So why is everyone blaming Trump?

For the lockdowns? Doubtful Holcomb would have locked down without the feds recommendation. That came from Fauci. Trump is the chief executive. But as I said, at least for the initial lockdowns, I don't think it's fair to put that on Trump, because no one knew any better. After it became more apparent that it was political, I'd rather Trump have shut Fauci down. But also, now that he's taking credit for it, the blame comes with it, regardless.