The Official Hot Rod Thread - Part 4: Burnouts for Distance

[Bigtanker]

Damnit man thats a Radial.

I think.....

28 cylinders. Turbo AND super charged.

 

[maxwelhse]

I bought that TA on a close out as no one wanted it.
Really an OK car but man it was not impressive.

We had a habit back in the day of buying Ponchos and swapping in BB chevy's as they set right in the car save for the water neck and battery being on the wrong side.
And if you were not in tune with the differences in how they sounded they were street beasts.
Well, I hurt the 403 less than 6 months in and after dealing with the warranty BS I pulled the repaired engine/trans and sold it to some wide eyed young man with big plans for his "G" body. .
Made some calls and secured a BB chevy and a T-400. Headers and little else besides a long weekend thrash and I drove it to work on Monday morning. No shaker yet but hey...

Did not make it to work when the wheel hop snapped the pinion off.

A 12 bolt from a Camaro bolts right in....

I've heard that story, but it's always entertaining.

I bet that kid thought that 200hp 403 was just a monster in his Cutlass. Probably saved his life not giving him anything actually hot.

 

[churchmouse]

I've heard that story, but it's always entertaining.

I bet that kid thought that 200hp 403 was just a monster in his Cutlass. Probably saved his life not giving him anything actually hot.

Not sure how that turned out for him. I loaded it in his dads truck, took my cash and watched him roll off.

2nd "X" got the TA. It was worth it.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

Good one Holley

 

[Jaybird1980]

Good one Holley

Haha.

Ordered. Putting it on the old 4.3.

 

[femurphy77]

Can't believe all of the Olds 403 hate goin' on here! Neighbor kid had one and he'd smoked it pretty bad in stock form. He took it to the local "guru" to have rebuilt and it sounded wicked as hell but was a total mutt. I was looking at it one day and I was pretty convinced it was a carb issue and he asked if I could take a shot at it. He popped the hood and pulled the air cleaner and there sat a shiny new Edelbrock carb. I told him if it had a Holley on it that we were in business but I didn't know anything about them thar new fangled Edelbrock carbs! A couple of days later he's knocking on my front door with a box he'd just received from Summit and inside was a new 780 double pumper.

Now we're talking! I messed around with it for several hours, got the idle circuits running right, rejetted, adjusted the linkage here and there. He pulled it out into the street and lit it up and the tires were still spinning when I heard it go into 3rd gear. He was grinning from ear to ear when he came back around the block.

His old man stopped by a couple of days later and junior threw him the keys. When his dad got back he promptly took the car away because he wasn't ready to bury his son yet.

 

[Jaybird1980]

They benefit from some work but in stock for they were lame like the rest of the engines at that time.

 

[churchmouse]

Can't believe all of the Olds 403 hate goin' on here! Neighbor kid had one and he'd smoked it pretty bad in stock form. He took it to the local "guru" to have rebuilt and it sounded wicked as hell but was a total mutt. I was looking at it one day and I was pretty convinced it was a carb issue and he asked if I could take a shot at it. He popped the hood and pulled the air cleaner and there sat a shiny new Edelbrock carb. I told him if it had a Holley on it that we were in business but I didn't know anything about them thar new fangled Edelbrock carbs! A couple of days later he's knocking on my front door with a box he'd just received from Summit and inside was a new 780 double pumper.

Now we're talking! I messed around with it for several hours, got the idle circuits running right, rejetted, adjusted the linkage here and there. He pulled it out into the street and lit it up and the tires were still spinning when I heard it go into 3rd gear. He was grinning from ear to ear when he came back around the block.

His old man stopped by a couple of days later and junior threw him the keys. When his dad got back he promptly took the car away because he wasn't ready to bury his son yet.

The compression/cam timing on them in emissions legal form made them worse than mutts. Buddy had 1 in a jet boat that he went through and pitched all the crap. That one ran pretty good.

Just remember.....in a controlled fashion....Air/Fuel in/lite it off and exhaust out.

 

[femurphy77]

They benefit from some work but in stock for they were lame like the rest of the engines at that time.

What??? 185hp @ 3600 rpm is lame? LAME???????

 

[churchmouse]

What??? 185hp @ 3600 rpm is lame? LAME???????

Thats how I hurt mine. It was a turd after 4K on the spin-o-meter. I was coming home from Indiana Beach on I-65 south running pretty hard. Really hard truth of it and it pitched at least 2 lifters and P-rods.
Yes I ran it to death the rest of the way home on 6.

 

[Jaybird1980]

What??? 185hp @ 3600 rpm is lame? LAME???????

Cam, Intake, and Headers could make that a whopping 250-275.

I all reality I got an 82 305 to be able to run pretty decent fairly easy.

By fairly simple I mean flat tops, cam, intake, carb, exhaust. Maybe not fairly easy after all. But it could run with basic mustangs at least.

 

[maxwelhse]

As I understand the Olds performance game (which is to say... not that much understanding), the biggest problem is they have absolutely terrible heads and even the aftermarket can only do so much based on their inherent geometry (push rod location? valve shrouding? Something like that). I've only known a handful of "fast" Olds people and they had bazillions of dollars in their motors to get them that way and were race fuel only.

Cam, Intake, and Headers could make that a whopping 250-275.

I was standing in the dyno bay when my buddy's seriously worked over Olds 455, with a custom Haltech EFI that he built for it, long tubes, whatever the "good" heads are, custom cam, etc, etc, made 275 to the tires. His was as built as any could be while still being anything close to a regular street motor. Dude had years and thousands in it to get that far. He was still tweaking on it, but... damn.

To be clear, I'm not throwing stones. My 5.0 put down 199rwhp on the same dyno a few minutes later.

 

[Jaybird1980]

As I understand the Olds performance game (which is to say... not that much understanding), the biggest problem is they have absolutely terrible heads and even the aftermarket can only do so much based on their inherent geometry (push rod location? valve shrouding? Something like that). I've only known a handful of "fast" Olds people and they had bazillions of dollars in their motors to get them that way and were race fuel only.



I was standing in the dyno bay when my buddy's seriously worked over Olds 455, with a custom Haltech EFI that he built for it, long tubes, whatever the "good" heads are, custom cam, etc, etc, made 275 to the tires. His was as built as any could be while still being anything close to a regular street motor. Dude had years and thousands in it to get that far. He was still tweaking on it, but... damn.

To be clear, I'm not throwing stones. My 5.0 put down 199rwhp on the same dyno a few minutes later.

Yep the Olds was long stroke smaller bore like the 305 I mentioned.
Mine made 250ish to the tires, was probably only 120 to tires stock, maybe less

 

[femurphy77]

To port match or not to port match? It's a GT40 intake which is supposedly a $1400 intake on the used market. Putting it on the 'vert, came with the engine I'm putting in the 'vert, it's not supposed to be a fire breather but personally I don't see any harm in it.






The heads have been ported and blended quite nicely and the amount of mismatch is apparent in this photo.

 

[churchmouse]

To port match or not to port match? It's a GT40 intake which is supposedly a $1400 intake on the used market. Putting it on the 'vert, came with the engine I'm putting in the 'vert, it's not supposed to be a fire breather but personally I don't see any harm in it.

View attachment 133673


View attachment 133674

The heads have been ported and blended quite nicely and the amount of mismatch is apparent in this photo.

Yes. Do it.

 

[churchmouse]

As I understand the Olds performance game (which is to say... not that much understanding), the biggest problem is they have absolutely terrible heads and even the aftermarket can only do so much based on their inherent geometry (push rod location? valve shrouding? Something like that). I've only known a handful of "fast" Olds people and they had bazillions of dollars in their motors to get them that way and were race fuel only.



I was standing in the dyno bay when my buddy's seriously worked over Olds 455, with a custom Haltech EFI that he built for it, long tubes, whatever the "good" heads are, custom cam, etc, etc, made 275 to the tires. His was as built as any could be while still being anything close to a regular street motor. Dude had years and thousands in it to get that far. He was still tweaking on it, but... damn.

To be clear, I'm not throwing stones. My 5.0 put down 199rwhp on the same dyno a few minutes later.

No knock on your friend and his major efforts but in my day the Olds and Buicks ruled the stock/super stock wars driven properly. They were and still are beasts in the automatic classes.
I owned a brand new 1970 W-30 (bought in 71) that was "Factory" rated at 430 HP if memory serves and it did a lot better on the chassis dyno than you friends before it was even broke in. Chet Elliots Sunoco in Speedway had an in floor dyno and we used it often. I worked at the station part time when needed basically for free just to use the shop/Dyno. My Olds rolled off 310 RWHP after a few timing/jet tweaks. So I figure something was missing from your friend equation. We saw this a lot with folks rolling their own. And again, no knocks from me. If you never try you will never know.

 

[Jaybird1980]

To port match or not to port match? It's a GT40 intake which is supposedly a $1400 intake on the used market. Putting it on the 'vert, came with the engine I'm putting in the 'vert, it's not supposed to be a fire breather but personally I don't see any harm in it.

View attachment 133673


View attachment 133674

The heads have been ported and blended quite nicely and the amount of mismatch is apparent in this photo.

Not sure which heads you used. 3 bars? 4bar? Explorer?
I wouldn't port match it that big it will likely kill a lot of velocity. I would definitely clean it up and smooth it out. Not sure what gasket that is, does it fit the heads? I use paper to make a stencil not the gasket.

 

[churchmouse]

Pontiacs and Olds had issues in the heads. The exhaust ports were not conducive to moving the gases easily. You were correct in shrouding etc.
You cant drive a Poncho like a Chevy. All you do is twist stuff up hence why I pitched lifters in the 403. Launch and shift early to keep it in its Torque band.
My putting a 427 in a 65 goat was mainly because I did not know how to drive that 389. I did know how to get up on the wheel behind a chevy.
Doing the TA was a no brainer.

Mondello makes some serious heads for the Olds. Big Chief does some great work for the poncho. Cam choice is important.
But they do not ring out like a chevy. They are pure torque monsters.

 

[churchmouse]

Not sure which heads you used. 3 bars? 4bar? Explorer?
I wouldn't port match it that big it will likely kill a lot of velocity. I would definitely clean it up and smooth it out. Not sure what gasket that is, does it fit the heads? I use paper to make a stencil not the gasket.

If you dont it will cause a vortices at the coupling point if there is any over lap. Dont have to go up in the runner very far to disrupt velocity.

 

[Jaybird1980]

If you dont it will cause a vortices at the coupling point if there is any over lap. Dont have to go up in the runner very far to disrupt velocity.

Yeah I know, but those gaskets may be bigger than the heads as well. I make a template of the head then use that not the gasket

I would not go that thin in these particular areas for sure.