St Mary's is NOT gun friendly

[rbrthenderson]

You are correct. But if the hospital is private property and me as agent of the hospital requests that you leave for a violation of our policy, you must comply. Understand it's not a law but as private property agent, it's the same as if i ask you to leave my house......Leave or you could be arrested for criminal trespass...I know it's arguing fine points but bottom line is you must comply or you then could be guilty of the trespass. Seen it happen many times and we have never been successfully sued.

Yes and that's why concealed means concealed.

 

[lashicoN]

Let me know how that works out for you




Kidding

lol, quite well, so far.

As Indiana permits don't have pictures on them why wouldn't a police officer have every right to ask for a valid form of picture ID to confirm you in fact are the party on the carry permit?

Because there is no such thing as ID in Indiana, and you don't need a Driver's License to walk into a hospital, so you may not have one on you.

With identity theft at an all time high and the fact that the carry permit can be passed off by anyone as their own since the law states a picture ID doesn't have to be presented until an infraction of the law occurs. I think that's a joke in itself.

It isn't my fault the carry LICENSE doesn't have a photograph of myself on it. I paid $125 for it, the state could have used that money to make the license a little more than a pink piece of paper that anyone could copy, but forging the license doesn't make a ton of sense either, since the only time I produce it is when a cop asks to see it, and then he calls it in to see if it's legit. You think it's a joke that people don't have to show identification or self identify until after an infraction has been committed? How else would you do? Put a chip in our foreheads that cops can scan with radar guns so they can have our life story while we're walking around, not doing anything wrong? That sounds like a joke to me, a real bad one.

You are correct. But if the hospital is private property and me as agent of the hospital requests that you leave for a violation of our policy, you must comply. Understand it's not a law but as private property agent, it's the same as if i ask you to leave my house......Leave or you could be arrested for criminal trespass...I know it's arguing fine points but bottom line is you must comply or you then could be guilty of the trespass. Seen it happen many times and we have never been successfully sued.

That's exactly what he just said. Is there an echo in here or something?

 

[Titanium_Frost]

Update:

Just got off the phone with the EPD Captain, went well. Basically he admitted I did nothing wrong but he believed the sugar-coated story the Sgt gave him first so he also said he didn't do anything wrong either. I stated that it could have gone better and the Capt agreed but said I should have "just handed him my permit and license and been on my way". However NEVER did he say I HAD to give it to him and he knew I was right in that.

Unfortunately it turned into drivel about OC vs CC and I told the Capt that I was CC just not well but I usually OC. He was shocked that the cops had never been called on me before. He advised me to conceal and I told him I would not. So he said that at any time a cop could come up to me and ask for my permit. I replied as long as that's all they do and want, I will gladly show them my HANDGUN LICENSE and that's all. He said then we won't have a problem.

 

[rmabrey]

This is rather unusual for Evansville. Cops here dont usually care, and Ive never heard of a single one giving an CC speech

 

[youngda9]

Basically he admitted I did nothing wrong but he believed the sugar-coated story the Sgt gave him first so he also said he didn't do anything wrong either.

Wagons circled...SOS

 

[WillyUSMC]

I've been reading posts on INGO for a little while now, and finally decided to register and weigh in on this issue. It sounds to me like the Security Officer was just doing his job in enforcing the hospital policy, and that you were much less than compliant with him. I understand that it was not posted anywhere, but it does not have to be posted on private property for it to be a valid regulation of that facility, and when he approached you to inform you, I think it could have been better handled, in the fact maybe you could have been more willing to comply with his requests. I strongly believe that much of the anti-gun sentiment, is brought on by law abiding citizens that have a very poor attitude about their carrying status. Yes it is legal to carry open or concealed in Indiana, but when approached by a uniformed, armed, Security Officer, maybe your compliance with his requests, would have made it easier for him to talk to you in a more private manner, and avoided the "huge scene" that it caused. If it was as huge of a scene as you have described perhaps the LEO felt you were displaying disorderly conduct with your noncompliance with the Security Officer, thus giving him probable cause to request ID from you.
I am absolutely as pro-carry and pro 2nd Amendment as they come, but I also believe strongly in discretion and good common sense. I don"t know of any hospitals that are really "Gun Friendly" so to speak of. I understand that you feel as if your rights have been infringed upon, but these all seem like very reasonable requests from the Security Officer. I'm sure that the main concern of the hospitals security dept is safety for everyone. How do they know that you are a law abiding citizen and not some thug, if you refuse to show them your valid permit? Its incidents like these that lead people to being anti gun, and that make us gun owners/carriers look bad as a whole, in the eye of the general public. ( Just FYI I don't really care about pleasing John Q Public, but its certainly a good idea to keep a positive image of gun owners, rather than give anti-gun folks and even people who are on the fence about the issue something to make a bad example of, especially when it comes close to elections). Anyways I'm sure that I've pissed in some folks cheerios with this post, but I make no apologies and completely stand behind all I have said. There are two sides to every story and we have been given yours, and no others. Best of luck to you in "ripping a few people some new Aholes". Also your comment about " no one told my wife she couldn't carry" further shows you've taken nothing away from this, and that you've got some growing up to do. I would certainly think that as a new father with a baby in the nicu you'd be more focused on that, rather than pushing the limits and paving your own road to getting yourself and/or your wife banned from the hospital. Best of luck to you.

 

[Titanium_Frost]

I've been reading posts on INGO for a little while now, and finally decided to register and weigh in on this issue. It sounds to me like the Security Officer was just doing his job in enforcing the hospital policy, and that you were much less than compliant with him. I understand that it was not posted anywhere, but it does not have to be posted on private property for it to be a valid regulation of that facility, and when he approached you to inform you, I think it could have been better handled, in the fact maybe you could have been more willing to comply with his requests. I strongly believe that much of the anti-gun sentiment, is brought on by law abiding citizens that have a very poor attitude about their carrying status. Yes it is legal to carry open or concealed in Indiana, but when approached by a uniformed, armed, Security Officer, maybe your compliance with his requests, would have made it easier for him to talk to you in a more private manner, and avoided the "huge scene" that it caused. If it was as huge of a scene as you have described perhaps the LEO felt you were displaying disorderly conduct with your noncompliance with the Security Officer, thus giving him probable cause to request ID from you.
I am absolutely as pro-carry and pro 2nd Amendment as they come, but I also believe strongly in discretion and good common sense. I don"t know of any hospitals that are really "Gun Friendly" so to speak of.
I understand that you feel as if your rights have been infringed upon, but these all seem like very reasonable requests from the Security Officer. I'm sure that the main concern of the hospitals security dept is safety for everyone. How do they know that you are a law abiding citizen and not some thug, if you refuse to show them your valid permit? Its incidents like these that lead people to being anti gun, and that make us gun owners/carriers look bad as a whole, in the eye of the general public. ( Just FYI I don't really care about pleasing John Q Public, but its certainly a good idea to keep a positive image of gun owners, rather than give anti-gun folks and even people who are on the fence about the issue something to make a bad example of, especially when it comes close to elections). Anyways I'm sure that I've pissed in some folks cheerios with this post, but I make no apologies and completely stand behind all I have said. There are two sides to every story and we have been given yours, and no others. Best of luck to you in "ripping a few people some new Aholes". Also your comment about " no one told my wife she couldn't carry" further shows you've taken nothing away from this, and that you've got some growing up to do. I would certainly think that as a new father with a baby in the nicu you'd be more focused on that, rather than pushing the limits and paving your own road to getting yourself and/or your wife banned from the hospital. Best of luck to you.

Too bad you wasted so much time on such a long and useless post.

 

[Rookie]

Hell of a first post

 

[rmabrey]

he posted 13 minutes ago and you guys havent start neg repping him to death yet?

 

[Titanium_Frost]

I've been reading posts on INGO for a little while now, and finally decided to register and weigh in on this issue.

THANK GOD!

It sounds to me like the Security Officer was just doing his job in enforcing the hospital policy, and that you were much less than compliant with him.

OF COURSE I WAS NONCOMPLIANT, THATS WHAT THIS WHOLE THREAD IS ABOUT.

I understand that it was not posted anywhere, but it does not have to be posted on private property for it to be a valid regulation of that facility,

NO ARGUMENT FROM ME

and when he approached you to inform you, I think it could have been better handled, in the fact maybe you could have been more willing to comply with his requests.

LMAO HE DIDNT "REQUEST" HE WAS THE ONE WHO RAISED HIS VOICE AND CAUSED THE SCENE, I WAS TRYING TO LEAVE QUIETLY AND HONOR HIS "REQUEST"

I strongly believe that much of the anti-gun sentiment, is brought on by law abiding citizens that have a very poor attitude about their carrying status.

THATS NOT WHAT THIS IS ABOUT, AND READ THE THREAD ABOUT POSITIVE CARRY ATTITUDE.

Yes it is legal to carry open or concealed in Indiana, but when approached by a uniformed, armed, Security Officer, maybe your compliance with his requests, would have made it easier for him to talk to you in a more private manner, and avoided the "huge scene" that it caused.

I DIDNT PICK THE TIME OR THE PLACE OF THIS OCCURANCE

If it was as huge of a scene as you have described perhaps the LEO felt you were displaying disorderly conduct with your noncompliance with the Security Officer, thus giving him probable cause to request ID from you.

THEN THAT IS WHAT HE SHOULD HAVE SAID, BEING THAT THAT NEVER CAME UP, AND I NEVER LOST MY COOL HE WOULD HAVE A REAL TOUGH TIME MAKING THAT STICK
I am absolutely as pro-carry and pro 2nd Amendment as they come, but I also believe strongly in discretion and good common sense. I don"t know of any hospitals that are really "Gun Friendly" so to speak of.
I understand that you feel as if your rights have been infringed upon, but these all seem like very reasonable requests from the Security Officer.

REASONABLE TO SOME IM SURE BUT I WAS NOT REQUIRED TO COMPLY AND IN DOING SO, THEY MADE A WRONG MOVE BY DETAINING ME AGAINST MY WILL

I'm sure that the main concern of the hospitals security dept is safety for everyone. How do they know that you are a law abiding citizen and not some thug, if you refuse to show them your valid permit?

REREAD IT AGAIN, I GAVE THE COP (NOT THE SECURITY GUARD) MY LTCH AS SOON AS HE ASKED, HE WAS THE MORON FOR NOT EVEN MENTIONING IT UNTIL 5 MINUTES WENT BY

Its incidents like these that lead people to being anti gun, and that make us gun owners/carriers look bad as a whole, in the eye of the general public.

AGAIN, INCORRECT. I WAS ABLE TO HAVE 4 GOOD CONVERSATIONS AND SHAPE PEOPLE'S MINDS FOR THE BETTER AS A DIRECT RESULT OF THIS. THIS IS THE TYPE OF THING THAT WILL HELP KEEP LEOS OFF OUR BACKS AND START TO HELP US RATHER THAN HINDER OUR RIGHTS

( Just FYI I don't really care about pleasing John Q Public,

BECAUSE THATS THE IMAGE THIS THREAD FORMS

but its certainly a good idea to keep a positive image of gun owners, rather than give anti-gun folks and even people who are on the fence about the issue something to make a bad example of, especially when it comes close to elections).

I AGREE, AND LETTING A COP (OR ANYONE) TRAMPLE ON YOUR RIGHTS IS NOT THE WAY TO DO IT

Anyways I'm sure that I've pissed in some folks cheerios with this post, but I make no apologies and completely stand behind all I have said. There are two sides to every story and we have been given yours, and no others.

I WAS VERY FORGIVING OF THEIR SIDE AND I COULD HAVE MADE IT LOOK A LOT WORSE THAN IT WAS

Best of luck to you in "ripping a few people some new Aholes".

THANK YOU

Also your comment about " no one told my wife she couldn't carry" further shows you've taken nothing away from this, and that you've got some growing up to do.

INCORRECT, EVEN THE POLICE CAPTAIN I SPOKE TO TODAY SAID THAT IF I HAD KEPT MY GUN CONCEALED BETTER I WOULD STILL BE CARRYING IT AT THE HOSPITAL WITH NO PROBLEMS. IT IS ONLY BECAUSE THEY SPECIFICALLY ASKED ME TO NOT CARRY IS WHY I CANNOT

I would certainly think that as a new father with a baby in the nicu you'd be more focused on that,

YOU HAVE NO IDEA

rather than pushing the limits and paving your own road

THAT IS WHAT I AM ABOUT AND WHAT I WILL TEACH AND DEMAND OF MY SON, WHY STOP NOW?

to getting yourself and/or your wife banned from the hospital. Best of luck to you.

They cannot keep me from seeing my son, I looked into that as well. I also spoke to the nurse in charge and she wanted me to come back in and hoped that I wasn't offended too badly from the whole ordeal.

 

[Titanium_Frost]

he posted 13 minutes ago and you guys havent start neg repping him to death yet?

I will if you will

 

[ljadayton]

I will if you will

looks like he got positive rep for that post

 

[Benny]

Why should Willy get negative repped for stating his opinion? Some of us may not agree with it, but it's his to have...Piling on the "new guy" is ghey.

Willy, if anyone negative reps you, let me know and I'll return the favor to them.



BTW, I was armed at the Evansville St. Mary's for about 2 hours today getting some blood/urine work done for my son and didn't have an issue.

(The results came back and Xander is fine, if anyone cares)

 

[edsinger]

Wow, I about got kicked out of Deaconess years ago, but it wasn't for a gun. I wanted to get my wife and new daughter home before the 24 hrs was up. I was paying cash and my kids doctor had ok'd the release but the doc on duty was playing golf or something. They threatened to charge me with kidnapping my own kid! The nerve. I said knock yourself out and left......(Mom and Baby were fine, no issues).

(The results came back and Xander is fine, if anyone cares)

Great!

 

[rmabrey]

Why should Willy get negative repped for stating his opinion?

Are you new here

 

[Benny]

Great!

Thanks.

Are you new here

I've been around for awhile, I just don't post much. Hence my extremely low post count.

 

[Bounty Hunter]

 

[rmabrey]

Thanks.



I've been around for awhile, I just don't post much. Hence my extremely low post count.

Well newbie, neg repping people with differing opinions is the cool thing to do.

 

[lrahm]

Willy, you at least got some positive feedback.

 

[rmabrey]

I will if you will

Just out of curiosity, did you by chance mention to any hospital staff that you posted this story here?