To mask or not to mask....That is the question. Part II

[jamil]

Yes, we should be nice to the over-reaching tyrants and forgive the errors of their ways.

It's not a binary. People's proclivities are a spectrum. Not all are over-reaching tyrants. The opinion on masks is all over the place. If you're going to try make exactly two pigeon holes in which to sort it, there are people who think people should wear masks, and they want to make everyone else wear them. And there are people of varying degrees of belief about masks, some of whom think people SHOULD wear masks, but still fall into the pigeon hole of not mandating them.

And even calling ALL the former "overreaching tyrants" is at least a little hyperbolic.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

This entire Fiasco has been a divide and concur move that even Gen. Patton would appreciate.
I know Mr Goebbels (Hitlers guy) would approve.

With every pandemic there is a third of the country that simply does not believe it is happening. It has been that way throughout history. This pandemic was no different.

It is human nature to doubt what they cannot see. It cannot be changed.

What could have helped would have been public education. Instead, .gov of both federal and state varieties chose to dictate, instead of to educate. That approached failed, yet again.

 

[Airtevron1]

 

[Ingomike]

I think it would be helpful to know when it's a fight and when it's just a disagreement. You guys keep kicking everyone out of the tent and eventually you'll be sitting there alone in your tent with your Rambo garb on waiting to start a fight with everyone.

The late Rush Limbaugh often said when true conservatism is on the ballot it wins. It won with Reagan and Trump, and was spouted by GWB enough to win. I am out of patience with the Romney/JK type. The party is enlarged by offense not defense, as demonstrated by the wins of Reagan/Trump and losses by Romney/McCain...

 

[churchmouse]

With every pandemic there is a third of the country that simply does not believe it is happening. It has been that way throughout history. This pandemic was no different.

It is human nature to doubt what they cannot see. It cannot be changed.

What could have helped would have been public education. Instead, .gov of both federal and state varieties chose to dictate, instead of to educate. That approached failed, yet again.

I can not disagree with this but please.....please.....please.....97% survival does not a Pandemic make. It just does not.

Making all other Flu strains disappear to count as #19 does not a pandemic make.

Counting every fracking thing as #19 to bump the numbers does not a Pandemic make.

Personally knowing soooooo many people who tested negative this dayy and 2 days later get a cold and employer sends them for a test that drops positive and they are locked up at home and "NEVER" get sick does not a pandemic make. Oh and I had it as well and no one around me caught it....."Pandemic" my ass.

 

[JettaKnight]

It's not a binary. People's proclivities are a spectrum. Not all are over-reaching tyrants. The opinion on masks is all over the place. If you're going to try make exactly two pigeon holes in which to sort it, there are people who think people should wear masks, and they want to make everyone else wear them. And there are people of varying degrees of belief about masks, some of whom think people SHOULD wear masks, but still fall into the pigeon hole of not mandating them.

And even calling ALL the former "overreaching tyrants" is at least a little hyperbolic.

There are two kinds of people: Those that pigeon hole people into two groups, and those that don't.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I can not disagree with this but please.....please.....please.....97% survival does not a Pandemic make. It just does not.

Making all other Flu strains disappear to count as #19 does not a pandemic make.

Counting every fracking thing as #19 to bump the numbers does not a Pandemic make.

Personally knowing soooooo many people who tested negative this dayy and 2 days later get a cold and employer sends them for a test that drops positive and they are locked up at home and "NEVER" get sick does not a pandemic make. Oh and I had it as well and no one around me caught it....."Pandemic" my ass.

Pandemic means wide-spread disease, has nothing to do with lethality.

Covid-19 will mutate (eventually) into something far less lethal and become (eventually) part of human DNA like many past pandemics.

We need more STEM education on risk abatement and assessment. We need more public education from .gov to instruct people on how to live with risk of disease. .gov failed us on all these measures and denial and snake oil filled the gaps while the bodies piled up.

If only .gov was out in front of Covid-19 instead of continually lying to us about . . . geez, damn near everything.

 

[MCgrease08]

we should be "back to normal" shortly. Kids back in school! Ball games! Craft brews on brewery porches!

These things are already happening and have been for months.

 

[jamil]

With every pandemic there is a third of the country that simply does not believe it is happening. It has been that way throughout history. This pandemic was no different.

It is human nature to doubt what they cannot see. It cannot be changed.

What could have helped would have been public education. Instead, .gov of both federal and state varieties chose to dictate, instead of to educate. That approached failed, yet again.

I don't think I would characterize it that this 1/3 believes it's not happening. It's the state of happening that is at issue. So they make up reasons why it's happening that aren't necessarily taking in all the facts.

What would help would be people in the press and the government not politicizing it. And, like I like to say, if you act like you're hiding something, it's reasonable to suspect you're hiding something. Fauci's antics should have gotten him fired back in March/April 2020 timeframe. Not because I think he's incompetent. But he presents himself to many people as untrustworthy, and I can't say I blame them.

Here's an example of things that make TPTB untrustworthy. Hydroxychloroquine. I don't want to wade in on the debate of whether it's an effective treatment or not. But just as soon as Trump praised it in a press conference, EVERYONE had to try to disprove it because ***dammit, Trump can't possibly be right about anything. I blame both sides for that. If Trump had just kept his mouth shut then politics would never have entered that debate and tainted the knowable facts. But since he did, every Trump hater had to go out and prove him wrong, by hook or by crook. Immediately someone threw together a study in haste that "proved" it was actually harmful. The press ran with it. And quietly the study was removed because it was ********.

Once politics has entered the realm of "science" it becomes untrustworthy because not everyone has access to all the facts. When the experts who have the most access to the facts develop political reasons to promote some facts while hiding others, we end up with "experts" on both sides spewing contradictory information. So then it becomes reasonable to believe either way. All the HCQ skeptics out there, I can't fault them. The fanbois, I can't fault them either. They all have reasons to believe what they believe. Same thing with masks, vaccines, whatever.

 

[churchmouse]

So I'd think the easiest way to counter that would be if everyone toned down the rhetoric and had some grace toward those they disagree with.

Easier said than done most times. But yes that would work "IF" those who have been empowered through this would tone down but they seem to be even more angry as we step away from the false narrative that masks help.

There was an incident at the other park I take the terrorists to a few weeks ago I mentioned but did not get into very deeply as the discussions were still heated.
A Karen and family in tow masked up to the hilt marched right into a pack of un-masked people adults and children and started barking at them loudly. She even started pushing people out of her way. She could have avoided that crowd but wanted to start some crap as was apparent from her assinine actions. I was 50 feet away and heard her.
Well she pushed a child and grabbed another in her spouting off and the mother of said child knocked this idiot on her ass. As she should have. It was a quick and very well excecated right uppercut that landed nicely much to the approval of the crowd. Her hubby started to pick up the cause and he was escorted back off the playground with his kids following untouched. Mom on the other hand continued running her injured pie hole while back peddling to catch hubby.

They left. 10 minutes later LEO pulled up. He was shown what had to be a video of her and they just nodded and left. I never got close as the terrorists were on the other side of the park from this.

People are nuts. They are nuts. Did I mention they are nuts.

 

[nonobaddog]

It's not a binary. People's proclivities are a spectrum. Not all are over-reaching tyrants. The opinion on masks is all over the place. If you're going to try make exactly two pigeon holes in which to sort it, there are people who think people should wear masks, and they want to make everyone else wear them. And there are people of varying degrees of belief about masks, some of whom think people SHOULD wear masks, but still fall into the pigeon hole of not mandating them.

And even calling ALL the former "overreaching tyrants" is at least a little hyperbolic.

You seem to imagine something binary in what I said. I didn't say anything about all people's proclivities - you did. You are the one bringing the "exactly two pigeon holes" to the table. Don't try to put that on me. I specifically referred to the over-reaching tyrants.

Just read the black part.

 

[JCSR]

 

[JettaKnight]

Easier said than done most times. But yes that would work "IF" those who have been empowered through this would tone down but they seem to be even more angry as we step away from the false narrative that masks help.

There was an incident at the other park I take the terrorists to a few weeks ago I mentioned but did not get into very deeply as the discussions were still heated.
A Karen and family in tow masked up to the hilt marched right into a pack of un-masked people adults and children and started barking at them loudly. She even started pushing people out of her way. She could have avoided that crowd but wanted to start some crap as was apparent from her assinine actions. I was 50 feet away and heard her.
Well she pushed a child and grabbed another in her spouting off and the mother of said child knocked this idiot on her ass. As she should have. It was a quick and very well excecated right uppercut that landed nicely much to the approval of the crowd. Her hubby started to pick up the cause and he was escorted back off the playground with his kids following untouched. Mom on the other hand continued running her injured pie hole while back peddling to catch hubby.

They left. 10 minutes later LEO pulled up. He was shown what had to be a video of her and they just nodded and left. I never got close as the terrorists were on the other side of the park from this.

People are nuts. They are nuts. Did I mention they are nuts.

What is in the water of Marion County?

That really is nuts. Honestly, I've never seen any incidents up here about masks.

The worst I see or hear is my wife: "You gotta put on your mask to leave!"
"Woman, I just ate a meal here for a half hour without it."
"But the rulez!"
"Oh, are they going to kick me out?"

(Note: if, or when, I actually call my wife "woman" it usually result in me getting a cracked rib.)

 

[jamil]

I can not disagree with this but please.....please.....please.....97% survival does not a Pandemic make. It just does not.

Making all other Flu strains disappear to count as #19 does not a pandemic make.

Counting every fracking thing as #19 to bump the numbers does not a Pandemic make.

Personally knowing soooooo many people who tested negative this dayy and 2 days later get a cold and employer sends them for a test that drops positive and they are locked up at home and "NEVER" get sick does not a pandemic make. Oh and I had it as well and no one around me caught it....."Pandemic" my ass.

A "pandemic" by definition doesn't consider a death rate. It's a "an outbreak of a disease that occurs over a wide geographic area" typically spanning more than one country. Covid has hit the entire world.

It's true enough that the way they're tallying Covid cases and deaths is very likely to be inaccurate. But I doubt it's that far off.

I think the quarantine has likely contributed to flu numbers decreasing, but I doubt it explains all of it. If there's an incentive to tally a death from flu-like symptoms to covid, it'll get marked as covid. Does that account for all? I don't think so. Few things like this are ever all. There are contributing factors. Attributing everything to one factor is very unlikely to be correct.

 

[churchmouse]

Pandemic means wide-spread disease, has nothing to do with lethality.

Covid-19 will mutate (eventually) into something far less lethal and become (eventually) part of human DNA like many past pandemics.

We need more STEM education on risk abatement and assessment. We need more public education from .gov to instruct people on how to live with risk of disease. .gov failed us on all these measures and denial and snake oil filled the gaps while the bodies piled up.

If only .gov was out in front of Covid-19 instead of continually lying to us about . . . geez, damn near everything.

Look;, they treated this politically. You have to see it. The sars was a wide spread disease that was far more harmful yet nothing. NADA. No real response as the sitting POTUS was on board with the powers that be and the MSM. So they did not destroy a vibrant economy to unseat him and then continue with that action when he was gone and the election stolen. This all ties in my friend.

Yet as non-mask mandate states are showing better numbers (maybe they are real) than Boa Constricted states and yet the left from the POTUS down are screaming like smashed cats as they loose the handle to control it. Thats my take on this.

 

[jamil]

View attachment 133324

Trump should have fired that guy last Spring.

 

[jamil]

Look;, they treated this politically. You have to see it. The sars was a wide spread disease that was far more harmful yet nothing. NADA. No real response as the sitting POTUS was on board with the powers that be and the MSM. So they did not destroy a vibrant economy to unseat him and then continue with that action when he was gone and the election stolen. This all ties in my friend.

Yet as non-mask mandate states are showing better numbers (maybe they are real) than Boa Constricted states and yet the left from the POTUS down are screaming like smashed cats as they loose the handle to control it. Thats my take on this.

Treating it politically had a high cost. It makes the people we should be able to trust completely untrustworthy.

 

[churchmouse]

A "pandemic" by definition doesn't consider a death rate. It's a "an outbreak of a disease that occurs over a wide geographic area" typically spanning more than one country. Covid has hit the entire world.

It's true enough that the way they're tallying Covid cases and deaths is very likely to be inaccurate. But I doubt it's that far off.

I think the quarantine has likely contributed to flu numbers decreasing, but I doubt it explains all of it. If there's an incentive to tally a death from flu-like symptoms to covid, it'll get marked as covid. Does that account for all? I don't think so. Few things like this are ever all. There are contributing factors. Attributing everything to one factor is very unlikely to be correct.

Your opinion my friend.
After Fauci stepped in in time and time again.....after Pelosi got her claws in it. After Schumer did as well holding the entire country hostage for some well seasoned pork. Etc and so on to still have any serious belief in all of this is just nuts.

Been on this rock a long time. I remember when the Asian Flu 1st showed its ugly head and every variation there of every year on going until they stopped calling it that. Sars and so on so just stop OK.

If it smells like and it looks like and of course feels like well.....

Yes people got sick and some died just like with "A"

 

[churchmouse]

Treating it politically had a high cost. It makes the people we should be able to trust completely untrustworthy.

At the cost of any trust I/we may have had left.

 

[jamil]

The late Rush Limbaugh often said when true conservatism is on the ballot it wins. It won with Reagan and Trump, and was spouted by GWB enough to win. I am out of patience with the Romney/JK type. The party is enlarged by offense not defense, as demonstrated by the wins of Reagan/Trump and losses by Romney/McCain...

It didn't win this time, now did it? But anyway, by no stretch of the imagination could you call Trump a conservative. He is a populist with a long list of positions he switched to at some point from his former positions. It's reasonable to say at least some of those things were pandering.

But anyway, that adage is sometimes correct-ish. Not necessarily conservatives, but non-progressive, non-establishment R's won a lot of seats in the House. Not enough to take it, but enough to make Democrats question themselves for about a week after the election.

How'd that work for you in the Senate? The Senate flip was mostly the quarrel over who was going to dole out the biggest stimulus checks at issue. Who won that argument? The most conservative candidate?

I think politics is way to complicated with way too many factors, to think that a simple rule of thumb like that could be true. but hey, the late Rush Limbaugh was practically god, so who am I to argue with god.