Thought I would share this email I got...

[SavageEagle]

How do you 'know' that what he 'really' wants to do is not what he actually said?

Can you show me anywhere, at any time, in his own words, not from some accusation by some right-wing hack, that he said he wants to create a 'civilian security force' ala the Nazi Brown Shirts, except in the same context as the video above where the out-of-context sound bite was taken from?

I'll even go so far as to say show me anything from any one of his advisors that he should have known about making any similar statements.

If you can do that then I will gladly change my position on the matter & apologize. Until then you are being dishonest by knowingly spreading rumors that are on their face known to be false for political purposes.

Also if you think that Obama will be able to force a Constitional Amendment through that will repeal the 22nd then you need to study the amendment process a little more closely. It takes a 2/3 majority of both houses of Congress to even be passed to the states for ratification. It then takes the legislatures of 3/4's of all the states to actually enact it. The Founders made it hard to Amend the Constitution for good reason. Thats why it has only been done 17 times since 1791. If it has that much support (which I highly doubt it does) then so be it. It is the system we live under. You still have the right to lobby against it.

to clarify: I do not in any way support this Amendment

How dare you call me dishonest!

When I get the time to search through thousands of videos of his campaign I will do so. But that will be tonight. You will just have to wait.

Do you honestly not recall him talking about a civilian security force and other organizations of the sort? Probably not because you obviously don't study your enemy.

I will try to find the video clip.

What's funny, you seem to be supporting him. What's more funny. A lot of people on here were dead set, hard core Anti-obama. Now all of a sudden some of you are thinking that, well, he's said he's going to do this, and now that he's almost prez he must be going to do that, so I'll support that. Don't ever call me a hypocrite without looking in the mirror first.

 

[SavageEagle]

Thought I would share this.

As per his website:
Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Urban Policy

Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

 

[SavageEagle]

I can't find anything on his website anymore about it. I wish I had saved the pages as I KNEW he would have them changed as his public policy changed.

Don't think for one second that he won't try to implement these programs I talked about. If you're lucky you might be able to find the threads about these on here with links and videos. If they still exist that is.

 

[Bigum1969]

How do you think Obama and Biden are going to make guns in this country childproof? Are they going to mandate trigger locks? How do they do this?

 

[SavageEagle]

Model America after Chicago and New York?

 

[finity]

How dare you call me dishonest!

When I get the time to search through thousands of videos of his campaign I will do so. But that will be tonight. You will just have to wait.

Do you honestly not recall him talking about a civilian security force and other organizations of the sort? Probably not because you obviously don't study your enemy.

I will try to find the video clip.

What's funny, you seem to be supporting him. What's more funny. A lot of people on here were dead set, hard core Anti-obama. Now all of a sudden some of you are thinking that, well, he's said he's going to do this, and now that he's almost prez he must be going to do that, so I'll support that. Don't ever call me a hypocrite without looking in the mirror first.

I didn't say you were dishonest. I said you were being dishonest if you continue to knowingly spread rumors you have no proof of being true as fact.

My offer still stands & I will gladly retract that & apologize right here:

Show me anywhere in any news report in enough detail to tell that he was talking about a real armed brown shirt style security force instead of community volunteerism. I would need a transcript or video of his own words (or like I said any staff whom he would have had knowledge of them saying it) with enough detail to put the remarks in their full context.


On my support for Obama:

If you remember (search if you like) I never said I was a supporter. I said I disliked Both Obama & McCain. I said I liked Ron Paul but he didn't finish the race. I liked Obama more than McCain (too much like Bush) except for his gun rights stance. I don't support everything Obama says now or may do in the future. I don't just blindly follow any party or ideology (I've even voted for Republicans a few times). The discussion was about specific remarks that he made that some people twisted to make it look like something its not for political gain.

 

[finity]

I can't find anything on his website anymore about it. I wish I had saved the pages as I KNEW he would have them changed as his public policy changed.

Don't think for one second that he won't try to implement these programs I talked about.

I will even help you out. There are internet archives that store websites periodically as they were in the past. I've used them several times to find info on a website that had been changed.

Here is one:

http://www.archive.org/web/web.php

There may be others.

Good luck in your search. Anybody else who wants to help, feel free.

I honestly want to know.

If you're lucky you might be able to find the threads about these on here with links and videos. If they still exist that is.

Are you saying that the threads were purposely deleted? By who? The mods here? Or maybe The Obama Internet Thought Police? Oh, come on, man.

 

[SavageEagle]

Ok I just wanted to see if you'd clarify that.

I will search for the campaign thing I watched with my mother. She and I fought for 3 hours over what it meant. When i showed her his website to prove my side she was shocked and it was never spoken of again.

The thing we watched was about him creating a voluntary force for those out of a job. Even people with past incarcerations and gang members would be allowed to jon to get them off the streets and give them meaningful jobs. I argued saying it was a civilian military that armed gangs and thugs to be doing what the police should be doing in the first place. I've been searching off and on and can't find the right videos. I will find them if they haven't been deleted from circulation though.

 

[SavageEagle]

Here's a snippet of what I'm talking about. It's re worded, but basic principles...

Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Defense

Leadership from the Top: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will restore the ethic of public service to the agenda of today's youth, whether it be serving their local communities in such roles as teachers or first responders, or serving in the military to keep our nation free and safe.

 

[SavageEagle]

BOOM! HEADSHOT! Found it! It doesn't go into great detail but I will still search the interwebs for the videos where he talks more indepth about it.

Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Defense under Develop Whole of Government Initiatives to Promote Global Stability

Create a Civilian Assistance Corps (CAC): An Obama-Biden administration will set a goal of creating a national CAC of 25,000 personnel. This corps of civilian volunteers with special skill, sets (doctors, lawyers, engineers, city planners, agriculture specialists, police, etc.) would be organized to provide each federal agency with a pool of volunteer experts willing to deploy in times of need at home and abroad.

More just above it...

Integrate Military and Civilian Efforts: An Obama-Biden administration will build up the capacity of each non-Pentagon agency to deploy personnel and area experts where they are needed, to help move soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines out of civilian roles.

 

[jedi]

Here is more for you SE to help you out.
This one shows how the BO website has changed over time on this idea.
President Obama To Bring Back Slavery | Sweetness & Light

See the "screenshots" that were taken of the website and how they have changed over time.

 

[SavageEagle]

Yes, I had forgotten about the InVoluntary servitude that obama proposed. Thanks for pointing that out!

Repped! After I spread some bacon first... remind me later!

 

[SavageEagle]

Also, That's not EXACTLY slavery. It is however, Forced Indentured Servitude. They are being "repaid with tax credits" but if they don't have a regular job they won't get that money.

Also, how can they do this, have a regular job, and be involved in school related activities such as Basketball, Football, Track, Boy Scouts, etc. with being forced into this?

 

[jedi]

No clue & No comment.
I only posted the article link for you.
The answers to your questions are "above my pay grade"?

 

[finity]

BOOM! HEADSHOT! Found it! It doesn't go into great detail but I will still search the interwebs for the videos where he talks more indepth about it.

Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Defense under Develop Whole of Government Initiatives to Promote Global Stability


More just above it...

Um..

That doesn't say anything about an armed civilian security force....

It says "doctors, lawyers, engineers, city planners, agriculture specialists, police, etc." could volunteer to help the government as experts in their respective fields if needed.

The second part actually says something exactly the opposite. It says he will move armed military personnel "out of civilian roles".


Quote:

Leadership from the Top: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will restore the ethic of public service to the agenda of today's youth, whether it be serving their local communities in such roles as teachers or first responders, or serving in the military to keep our nation free and safe.

Nope...still nothing about roving bands of civilians killing & maiming the 'non-believers'. Encouraging people to be teachers & EMTs or joining the military is a far cry from armed thugs & gangsters.

Keep trying.

 

[Ashkelon]

Hot Damn this is getting fun and a good debate to be had by all !! Ok finity, here goes - I volunteer with my son's school and donate to various charities and provide free professional services for the downtrodden. BUT I do so at my choosing. I pick and choose what activities and charities and which hardship cases to accept pro bono they don't pick me or tell me what my base acceptance has to entail.
I just really resent his grandstanding about public service when if he really wanted to be a unifying leader he would require those already on the receiving end to chip in. Kids that are already in school and working at becoming productive citizens deserve the benefit of the doubt and those educational tax credits as they will be the base of our economy in future generations. Give it to 'em for already doing what they are supposed to do.
Those that do NOT go to school or work or help the tax base for social services and lay up on the pipe with their old man or old lady should be the ones accountable for his public service directives but that won't happen because it was his first time voters that put him in office and if he alienates them there is only the first four years not the second.
An interesting ride it will be... I just don't expect the honeymoon to last long.

 

[finity]

Here is more for you SE to help you out.
This one shows how the BO website has changed over time on this idea.
President Obama To Bring Back Slavery | Sweetness & Light

See the "screenshots" that were taken of the website and how they have changed over time.

He realized the word "require" was a little strong & fixed it. It shows a good quality in my opinion. It shows someone who learns from their mistakes. It shows he's willing to back down from a bad policy instead of the "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead" mentality of the last 8 years. Contrary to conservative beliefs, being steadfast in your actions despite all of the facts & opinions around you to the contrary is not a good way to be. Its dangerous.

Encouraging community service is not some evil socialist plot to rule the world. Even with a bribe - the Peace Corps & military have been doing it for decades. I was given a $30,000 re-enlistment bonus when I re-upped. Not to mention the GI bill. I guess you don't consider the military community service?

I guess you'll have to try harder.

 

[Ashkelon]

finity

you make some excellent points. Maybe when this whole economy comes crashing down those of us here in the forum can work together to get this thing back on track.
I just want to know why he doesn't use language like require when he planes to hand out even more. Hell, George Bush has put us on the path of socialism Barry is just waltzing us over to fascism.

 

[finity]

Hot Damn this is getting fun and a good debate to be had by all !! Ok Plinker, here goes - I volunteer with my son's school and donate to various charities and provide free professional services for the downtrodden. BUT I do so at my choosing. I pick and choose what activities and charities and which hardship cases to accept pro bono they don't pick me or tell me what my base acceptance has to entail.
I just really resent his grandstanding about public service when if he really wanted to be a unifying leader he would require those already on the receiving end to chip in. Kids that are already in school and working at becoming productive citizens deserve the benefit of the doubt and those educational tax credits as they will be the base of our economy in future generations. Give it to 'em for already doing what they are supposed to do.
Those that do NOT go to school or work or help the tax base for social services and lay up on the pipe with their old man or old lady should be the ones accountable for his public service directives but that won't happen because it was his first time voters that put him in office and if he alienates them there is only the first four years not the second.
An interesting ride it will be... I just don't expect the honeymoon to last long.

I actually agree with the idea that people on public assistance should have to work for it if they are able. There are always jobs to do to help the community out. Isn't that what FDR did during the depression to get people working, while improving the nations infrastructure? Uh oh. You better be careful. Sounds like your getting pretty close to advocating Socialism.

But that is a completely seperate issue from the community service he is talking about.

OTOH, what is so wrong about asking for people to volunteer their time to help out their community. He is not forcing anyone to do this. He is encouraging it. Just like Bush encouraged people to donate money to local religious charities. Just like any other person who encourages people to build homes for Habitat, or donate to starving kids in Africa, or build a church in South America or "volunteer with my son's school and donate to various charities and provide free professional services for the downtrodden....". Are you saying that if someone in some PSA encouraged you to do these things that at that point you woud stop doing them because now you don't have a choice? Even though you still do?



Oh & still nothing on the wild bands of armed thugs wearing the Obama uniform dragging anyone off to the gulags for wearing an "America: Love It Or Leave It" T-shirt...

 

[SavageEagle]

Again that was the revised version. He was talking about those people being an ARMED SECURITY FORCE. This is just the precursor. He probably changed his thinking so this would seem like the only thing he wanted. I will continue to search tonight but I won't have much time because I have a new toy to drool over and proving you wrong isn't a top priority to me right now!