The Libertarian Party Race is Filling Up?

[steveh_131]

To be honest I believe my Johnson could give a better interview than Gary Johnson....I just can't take a guy seriously who crowd surfs at his age...

I listened to his Carolla interview, he sounded pretty dang good to me. You're really stuck on the crowd surfing thing, huh.

An Evangelical Atheist here on INGO once made the statement "There is nothing Libertarian in Christianity" and I pointed out (what should be obvious to anyone who has ever read a history book) how inaccurate that statement was with many documented facts connecting the Protestant Reformation to the emergence of representative Democracy even including the "We hold these Truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal and are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights" and he said he would never discuss this again with me because I missed his point and took his quote out of context.....

Unfortunately, many Christians do seem to think that their morals ought to be legislated for some reason. So it's not too surprising that many non-believers would find it incompatible with libertarian principles.

 

[Jludo]

To be honest I believe my Johnson could give a better interview than Gary Johnson....I just can't take a guy seriously who crowd surfs at his age...

I hope embarrassing yourself doesn't disqualify you from the presidency.

[video=youtube;MMKFIHRpe7I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMKFIHRpe7I[/video]

 

[mrjarrell]

LP Convention VP debate on taxes.
[video=youtube_share;djNvj5Nw9E0]http://youtu.be/djNvj5Nw9E0[/video]

 

[mrjarrell]

Livestream of the convention.

Libertarian Party on USTREAM: The Libertarian Party is the only political party in America devoted to the liberty of all Americans. Visit here to read our ...

 

[mrjarrell]

Weld is not having a good time at the convention. I can only hope that the delegates do not give Johnson what he wants this time and they elect an actual libertarian as the VP candidate.

Libertarian "dream ticket" in peril as Weld bombs in Orlando - POLITICO

 

[mrjarrell]

Nomination speeches from the presidential candidates will be starting in a few minutes, (see the link above for streaming). If I had to guess, right now, I'd guess that Gary Johnson is going to get the nomination. He had over 200 nominating tokens, more than twice the amount of the next candidate. Macafee is up first.

 

[mrjarrell]

Mcaffee sounded rather defeatist, but made some good points about down ticket candidates and continuing to support the party even if he doesn't get the nomination.

Johnson hit all the right notes and sounded really good. Made a point of addressing support for the Right to keep and bear arms.

Gary Johnson, in a nice show of solidarity, nominated Dr. Marc Allan Feldman of Ohio.

Feldman's speech was a cheerleading speech. Not very inspirational. He's just running to run, as far as I can tell.

(Edit: I'm editing this as they speak, better than multiple posts).

Oddly enough the sound went out as Petersen went up to speak. No idea what he had to say, but he looked enthusiastic.

Kevin McCormick's speech was good. Not the best speech, but well received and inspirational. Good party member speech.

Missed Darryl Perry's speech due to the sound issue.

 

[Jludo]

Austin Peterson has just a general smug annoyingness about him. I agree with stuff but damn he just comes across poorly.

 

[mrjarrell]

Austin Peterson has just a general smug annoyingness about him. I agree with stuff but damn he just comes across poorly.

I find him to be pompous and that plays poorly to the masses and most of us. His answers are on point, but his personality irks me.

 

[Jludo]

I'm as libertarian as they come but pragmatics need to take over the party. Never, ever going to get elected when the convention crowd is booing "I don't think you should be able to sell heroin to a five year old". Unreal.

 

[mrjarrell]

The "pragmatists" have been running the party for the last couple of cycles. They're the ones that gave us Barr and Johnson's first run and will likely renominate Johnson and Weld this go around. The so-called "radical" caucus is not even remotely in control of things these days. There's lots of overlap between the two, but the pragmatists are really the ones in control.

 

[Jludo]

The "pragmatists" have been running the party for the last couple of cycles. They're the ones that gave us Barr and Johnson's first run and will likely renominate Johnson and Weld this go around. The so-called "radical" caucus is not even remotely in control of things these days. There's lots of overlap between the two, but the pragmatists are really the ones in control.

I should say based on the crowd.

 

[MisterChester]

An Evangelical Atheist here on INGO once made the statement "There is nothing Libertarian in Christianity" and I pointed out (what should be obvious to anyone who has ever read a history book) how inaccurate that statement was with many documented facts connecting the Protestant Reformation to the emergence of representative Democracy even including the "We hold these Truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal and are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights" and he said he would never discuss this again with me because I missed his point and took his quote out of context.....

You and Rambone are who came to mind right off of the bat when he made that statement...It was so ignorant I thought at first he may be joking and just tried to gently show him the fallacy of his statement but he seemed to have a genuine bit of hurt butt over it...

I am sure there are some Christian churches that have beliefs that are more or less compatible with libertarian principles. It's virtually impossible to be a libertarian if one holds the bible to be completely and literally true.

 

[IndyDave1776]

I am sure there are some Christian churches that have beliefs that are more or less compatible with libertarian principles. It's virtually impossible to be a libertarian if one holds the bible to be completely and literally true.

I'm not so sure about this. As I understand it, the Bible would hold certain activities that the libertarian would accept to be unacceptable, but it is equally true that the Bible calls for restricting licentious use of liberty yourself, not having it imposed on you or imposing it on others. Noninterference (with the exception of advising the practitioners of potential consequences administered by God) with others choices which under biblical standards are wrong so long as others are not being harmed does not strike me as a problem here.

 

[mrjarrell]

Gary Johnson has won the presidential nomination after a second round of voting. Austin Petersen came in a distant 2nd. Now comes the voting for VP.

 

[mrjarrell]

I am sure there are some Christian churches that have beliefs that are more or less compatible with libertarian principles. It's virtually impossible to be a libertarian if one holds the bible to be completely and literally true.

Not true. I am reminded that the LPIN candidate for governor in Indiana a few years ago was Kenn Gividen. Kenn was a founding member of the Moral Majority. He was already pretty libertarian and became even moreso after they imploded. I know a number of christian libertarians. Also know many who are jews and muslims. The LP is a big tent and the philosophy of libertarianism allows for great flexibility in many areas. The basic premise to be accepted by libertarians is the Non Aggression Principle. If you can accept that the rest is easy.

 

[MisterChester]

I'm not so sure about this. As I understand it, the Bible would hold certain activities that the libertarian would accept to be unacceptable, but it is equally true that the Bible calls for restricting licentious use of liberty yourself, not having it imposed on you or imposing it on others. Noninterference (with the exception of advising the practitioners of potential consequences administered by God) with others choices which under biblical standards are wrong so long as others are not being harmed does not strike me as a problem here.

As I'm sure you know, there are instances where people were killed by God (or someone acting on his behalf) for things that did not inherently harm others or infringe their rights. That would make any libertarian cry foul.

 

[MisterChester]

Not true. I am reminded that the LPIN candidate for governor in Indiana a few years ago was Kenn Gividen. Kenn was a founding member of the Moral Majority. He was already pretty libertarian and became even moreso after they imploded. I know a number of christian libertarians. Also know many who are jews and muslims. The LP is a big tent and the philosophy of libertarianism allows for great flexibility in many areas. The basic premise to be accepted by libertarians is the Non Aggression Principle. If you can accept that the rest is easy.

I don't doubt that at all, only in instances where the person in question believes the entire bible as literal fact is where I'd see conflict. In my post above, at least in the Old Testament, God didn't care much for the non-aggression principle.

 

[IndyDave1776]

As I'm sure you know, there are instances where people were killed by God (or someone acting on his behalf) for things that did not inherently harm others or infringe their rights. That would make any libertarian cry foul.

I don't doubt that at all, only in instances where the person in question believes the entire bible as literal fact is where I'd see conflict. In my post above, at least in the Old Testament, God didn't care much for the non-aggression principle.

The two points that I would raise is that the role of the believer typically is congruent with libertarian thinking at least at the level of action, or rather the lack thereof, in the absence of harm to others. That does not require God Himself to be a libertarian.

Second is that the appearance of Christ represents a clarification of the nature of God and His nature and purposes. The fulfilled concept of grace and that of allowing God to judge wrong-doing in His time does not conflict with the Old Testament, much in the same way that parents tolerate their children crapping their pants until they don't tolerate it any more.

 

[mrjarrell]

Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton awarded Libertarian Outreach Award for helping to grow the Libertarian Party. lol.