Anti-Law Enforcement Posts

[steveh_131]

I doubt that many decent people actually dislike police officers. I think the problem is that for those of us who stay out of trouble, our only interaction with them is typically negative (traffic infractions).

99% of the time that I see a cop, I go into panic mode and wonder if I did something that's going to earn me an outrageous ticket. This isn't the fault of the police officers, it's the fault of a system that uses the police force as glorified tax collectors.

You know what would be a good way to combat these negative feelings? Obviously, eliminating 90% of the needless traffic infractions would help, but that's not something the cops themselves can do.

You can start by understanding that when you pull me over, you're not making me or anybody else safer. You're just collecting money from me. I don't need to hear a lecture about how unsafe it is for me to be doing 65 on a dry, empty 6-lane highway. I don't need to be grilled about where I'm going like I'm a common thief and far below you. It's 6 AM on a Monday morning, I'm obviously going to WORK, not a drug deal. Try walking up to the car and saying "Hello. I apologize for intruding on your life, but today you've been semi-randomly selected to be taxed by the local government under the guise of public safety. Here is your absurdly large bill, including hundreds of dollars for a court date that will not actually happen. Have a nice day."

 

[Eddie]

I think that the position that the moderators have stated in several LEO threads, that we can discuss specific instances of behavior by LEO's but not make broad, negative statements about all LEOs is a fine policy.

I wholeheartedly agree with Rhino that no one should hold themself above criticism.

I have seen threads that simply ask "I got stopped by a cop and they did this, why?" I have seen threads about positive encounters with LEOs.

I think that it is a normal, healthy thing to be critical of those in authority and to ask questions. I spent my time with a badge on and in no way did I ever expect to achieve universal popularity.

So I guess when I see the OP complain about "anti-LEO" posts, to me that means posts that make negative statements about all police officers and not posts that disect and discuss specific incidents.

If the OP feels that we should not be able to discuss specific occurances, then I disagree.

 

[Kick]

You can start by understanding that when you pull me over, you're not making me or anybody else safer. You're just collecting money from me. I don't need to hear a lecture about how unsafe it is for me to be doing 65 on a dry, empty 6-lane highway. I don't need to be grilled about where I'm going like I'm a common thief and far below you. It's 6 AM on a Monday morning, I'm obviously going to WORK, not a drug deal. Try walking up to the car and saying "Hello. I apologize for intruding on your life, but today you've been semi-randomly selected to be taxed by the local government under the guise of public safety. Here is your absurdly large bill, including hundreds of dollars for a court date that will not actually happen. Have a nice day."

I agree with everything in your post accept for this last part. Although I understand that most of the interactions that the general law abiding citizens have with the police are traffic related, 70% of accidents are caused by aggressive drivers. I understand that you are saying that the road is empty but, what are you going to do when something darts out in front of you or grandma blue hair pulls out across all 3 lanes in your direction to pull 3 lanes back to drive 20 miles per hour. If you are speeding, you are most likely not going to be able to stop in time.

Granted I would personally not write someone for that but, I would prolly stop you just to tell you the above stated.

 

[Paco Bedejo]

I doubt that many decent people actually dislike police officers. I think the problem is that for those of us who stay out of trouble, our only interaction with them is typically negative (traffic infractions).

99% of the time that I see a cop, I go into panic mode and wonder if I did something that's going to earn me an outrageous ticket. This isn't the fault of the police officers, it's the fault of a system that uses the police force as glorified tax collectors.

You know what would be a good way to combat these negative feelings? Obviously, eliminating 90% of the needless traffic infractions would help, but that's not something the cops themselves can do.

You can start by understanding that when you pull me over, you're not making me or anybody else safer. You're just collecting money from me. I don't need to hear a lecture about how unsafe it is for me to be doing 65 on a dry, empty 6-lane highway. I don't need to be grilled about where I'm going like I'm a common thief and far below you. It's 6 AM on a Monday morning, I'm obviously going to WORK, not a drug deal. Try walking up to the car and saying "Hello. I apologize for intruding on your life, but today you've been semi-randomly selected to be taxed by the local government under the guise of public safety. Here is your absurdly large bill, including hundreds of dollars for a court date that will not actually happen. Have a nice day."

My last interaction with a police officer was about 12 years ago in my hometown of Bluffton. It was about an hour after the Superbowl ended. I went to McDonalds to grab a shake on my way home from a party. A police cruiser followed me out of the parking lot, then proceeded to ride my arse for about 2 miles (we're talkin' like 1/4 car length behind me). I drove straight, steady, and 5 under the speed limit because SR-1 was newly paved & wet that night.

Well, as we approached Wiley St, going southbound, the light turned yellow. Since the roads were slick, the approach to the intersection was downhill, and I had a police cruiser on my rear bumper, I decided that the safest thing to do was to proceed through the yellow light, which I did without accelerating.

As you might guess, they immediately flipped on their lights & followed me through the intersection (thus running a red light). Looking in my rear-view, I can see that it was two officers around the age of 22-24.

Long story short, he studied me carefully for signs that I had been drinking...which I hadn't been...not exactly what us Campus Life volunteers did during Superbowl parties. Frustrated that he hadn't caught the fish he wanted, he ticketed me for disregarding a traffic signal, though I had clearly entered the intersection while the signal was yellow.

I had another incident about 3 months prior while driving through Zanesville at 3am on my way home (again, I don't drink). Well, I was going precisely the speed limit since I knew Zanesville's only income came from radar guns & DUIs. Driving 45 in a 45, I was pulled over by a ninja-cruiser. I swear he came out of an uninterrupted row of bushes... Anyhow, I pulled over quickly & safely, turned on my interior lights, put my hands on the dash, & waited. He came up to the window & asked if I knew why he had pulled me over. I said that I didn't. He then claimed that he clocked me at 45 in a 35 zone. I then pointed ahead to the sign about 25 yards in front of where I had pulled over & stated that it looks like the 'Begin 35 MPH' sign is up that way. He started asking where I was going & why I was out so late...to which I replied that I was returning home from my girlfriend's house. He decided to give me a written warning...for nothing, mind you. I'm convinced it was just another 4th amendment violation & he was simply fishing for a drunk.

Since then, each officer must earn my trust. I guarantee the two kids were simply pissed that they had to work on the night of the big game & they wanted to catch them some drunks to sate their egos. I know for a fact that Zanesville relies heavily upon traffic violations to keep their little village running.

Such egos & motives are why each person in authority must be scrutinized & never trusted by default.

 

[Kick]

If the OP feels that we should not be able to discuss specific occurances, then I disagree.

Specific Occurances are part of what this site is about!

 

[homeless]

Specific Occurances are part of what this site is about!

How do you know? You just got here and started painting us all with the broad brush of "Cop Haters".

 

[Kick]

How do you know? You just got here and started painting us all with the broad brush of "Cop Haters".

WOW! Did you even read the original post?!?!?!

Please read it or re-read it and post again, would really like to know if you still feel that way...

 

[rambone]

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I haven't personally felt disrespected on this board. I saw a few posts about LE where members who were LEO's stated that they were and offered up explanations for why what happened happened. Some of the threads ended up with the LEO getting bashed for what happened in that instance or similar instances.

Yes that has happened and will most likely continue to happen, because people perceived a problem with what happened, even if the OP didn't. Most of the time that I've seen it, is where an Officer asks/demands that the person disarm during the encounter. Or where the Officer appears to sanction what people perceive to be a violation of their rights. Yes I understand Officer safety, but why disarm the person if they don't have reasonable suspicion that they are a threat?

I think it was the Brady campaign that stated that licensed carriers have killed something like 110 people since 2007 and that 6 of them were LEO. How many Officers were struck by some scums vehicle that tried to flee or hit them intentionally in that same time? I don't have any cites but I would guess it's higher. So for officer safety they should logically order everyone out of the vehicle on any traffic stop before the officer leaves his vehicle, why don't they do that? Or how many officers have been injured or killed by someone with their bare hands at a traffic stop? Should motorists be required to exit the vehicle and handcuff themselves to the bumper of the squad car before the officer leaves his car? Yes they make something for that.

Yep, let's keep it alive and polite!

I for one, thoroughly appreciate the LEO's on this forum. Their insight and perspective is appreciated. That said, both sides of this discussion need to step back and chill occasionally.

Be careful with your words. It's not about just you.

Agreed

I have "bashed" LEOs here before, but not in general either a specific officer/group of officers, or their actions. But I have also stated that IMO that the vast majority of officers are good people who do a good job. In my youth I was arrested several times, I never held a grudge or even had a grudge against them for that. I deserved it and knew it. Same with getting tickets.

But I have had some negative experiences, such as getting pulled over on my way to work because I had snow on my license plate, I had cleaned it before I left but it was snowing like crazy, it took me about a hour and a half to drive what usually took about 25 minutes. I was stopped because it was a Friday night and it was a fishing expedition to find out why I was out. In that same town I was pulled over at least 8x in a 2 year period. That is more than in the past 15 years that I have been driving elsewhere. Every time on a Fri. or Sat night. Never received a ticket or even a warning, just where are you going? Where are you coming from? What department? etc. Do I bash what appears to be policy for that department? Heck yeah.

 

[Bastispah]

like ANYTHING else, a few bad people ruin it for everyone. I've run into professional police officers, and kids that were picked on in High School and are out for revenge, but like i said you will have that in ANY job any where. People are people regardless of the job. Being a LEO would be a tough, nerve racking job and is bound to make them a little crazy at times. I thank you all for your service

 

[leftsock]

In reference to the first post in this thread from kick4426, he mentions

However, a SMALL NUMBER of the posters seem to keep posting anti-law enforcement posts.

If they're news articles that are being posted, we have to remember that generally only bad news gets noticed, and it's a rare day when we'd see a headline like "LEOs publicly cheer on gun-toting citizens for exercising their 2A rights." Well, maybe if they did cheer us on en masse, we might see that headline.


I enjoyed another post from kick446 where he wrote:

Just reminding people that LEO's do not make the laws and we do not agree with all of the laws we are paid to enforce. We simply have to do a job to put food on our familes tables like everyone else.

Maybe I should put on my tin foil hat when I say this, but we regular citizens have to remember that their job is law enforcement, not to be our buddies. We citizenry made our laws and influence the manner in which LEOs interact though contact with them, their superiors, and our legislature, and if we don't like it, we should change it.

And I remember what Cool Hand Luke said:

calling it your job don't make it right

 

[Robert Richardson]

So....when do we start playing "Good Cop-Bad Cop" ?

 

[haldir]

Anyone that says there have been no anti-LEO posts in the past are either blind, unable to read, new or they don't pay attention. I believe it has run off several good people from here as I have notice LEOs that went missing shortly after one of the Cop Bashing Orgies that we have periodically. I wasn't going to respond to these any more but I couldn't help myself given the dead officer in Mishawaka this week. Of course they make mistakes, of course there have been and are bad cops. But do we really compare them with plumbers given the number of officers that die each year because they are out there defending their communities.

 

[Paco Bedejo]

Anyone that says there have been no anti-LEO posts in the past are either blind, unable to read, new or they don't pay attention. I believe it has run off several good people from here as I have notice LEOs that went missing shortly after one of the Cop Bashing Orgies that we have periodically. I wasn't going to respond to these any more but I couldn't help myself given the dead officer in Mishawaka this week. Of course they make mistakes, of course there have been and are bad cops. But do we really compare them with plumbers given the number of officers that die each year because they are out there defending their communities.

Ah, emotional appeal to a logical issue...how I love thee.

What I consider bashing & what you consider bashing are likely far different from each other.

Being critical of a LEO for their actions is not bashing. It's an attempt to hold someone, to whom we've imparted great power & responsibility, accountable. It's the same as griping about Obama's actions & policies. It's often necessary & warranted.

Please post an example of what you consider 'cop bashing'. That would help to frame this...erm...for lack of a better term, discussion.

 

[henktermaat]

To the OP:
Just as you occasional have a bad cop, you'll occasionally have a member here making blanket statements. Thankfully most folks here are pretty rational.

Also keep in mind that people have emotions and occasionally vent.

 

[dross]

Ok, what ever happened to simply believing in the good in humanity? According to your policy of "not trusting until trust is warranted", I should put everyone I deal with in handcuffs because, I should assume the worst of them?

Thank God you most likely work at a burger king and the biggest decesion you will ever have to make is if it is time to throw the fries out and make new..

Oh, and thanks for the negative rep on my previous post.

As the government at all levels continues to grow in size, those of you who work for a government should be grateful to the folks in the private sector who generate the pool of money you're paid from.

The issue of not trusting until trust is warranted is exactly what typically causes most of the LEO battles on this site. Most of us who carry are very protective of our rights, and when an officer is politely informed that a person is a permit holder and then responds to that civility by taking the weapon, unloading it, or disassembling it, or asking rude questions about why you need to be armed, or any variety of indignities, we're going to criticize it. There are several LEOs on this site who defend those actions, and when that happens it gets heated.

There is a certain irony in an armed man disarming another armed man so he'll feel safe.

Trust goes both ways.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

What about my safety? How is a person that doesn't know squat about my gun going to safely take it from me loaded, cocked and locked without risking shooting me negligently? With most LEOs that I know, they're lucky to be able to safely handle their own loaded gun, much less removing mine from my pocket or holster. I have a few with pretty light triggers, does johnny know what's been done to my gun?

 

[Blue Tile Spook]

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[public servant]

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IBTL



This stuff is better than Springer...

 

[cce1302]

We appreciate the LEOs that respect the rights of the citizens.