Rounds for a G19?

[rlmx]

What type of ammo should be used at the range vs. daily CC?

 

[melensdad]

Any plated or copper jacketed ammo will work.

For range I use full power loads, but cheaper bullet construction, so any bulk FMJ from a name brand maker or my own full power handloads. For self defense, any of the modern high quality bullets like Winchester, Federal or Hornady self-defense/police loads.

 

[42769vette]

9mm

Any ammo used in a carry peice should atleast once been tested on the range.

 

[rlmx]

Length of Time to Receive Conceal and Carry Permit?

How long does it take to receive a CAC permit from the state of IN?

Also, I made a mistake and applied for a 4 year vs. lifetime. I realize that I am stuck w/ a 4 year. But, should I just wait 4 years to apply for the lifetime permit (assuming that the Goverment doesn't take away our right)?

 

[leftsock]

Not sure what CAC is an acronym for, but in Indiana, we have a License to Carry a Handgun, or LTCH. Which does not specify how the handgun is carried (concealed or not).

I've never had any cheap 9mm ammo have an issue in a G19, G17, or G26.

For defense, there are plenty of high-quality rounds to choose from, some of them being:
Remington Golden Saber
Hornady Critical Defense
Hornady Critical Duty

 

[melensdad]

How long does it take to receive a CAC permit from the state of IN?

Also, I made a mistake and applied for a 4 year vs. lifetime. I realize that I am stuck w/ a 4 year. But, should I just wait 4 years to apply for the lifetime permit (assuming that the Goverment doesn't take away our right)?

We have a License to Carry a Handgun. It is NOT a "concealed" carry permit, we are legally allowed to carry openly on our hips just like Barney Fife does.

As for the switch to the LIFETIME license, you cannot renew before its due. So you need to wait. But don't worry, there is no move in Indiana to take away the Lifetime license.

As for the wait time, anywhere from 2 weeks to 3 months. A lot of it depends on how backlogged they are in the paperwork.

 

[cosermann]

What melensdad said. For specific carry ammo recommendations, see here:

Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo

 

[rlmx]

We have a License to Carry a Handgun. It is NOT a "concealed" carry permit, we are legally allowed to carry openly on our hips just like Barney Fife does.

As for the switch to the LIFETIME license, you cannot renew before its due. So you need to wait. But don't worry, there is no move in Indiana to take away the Lifetime license.

As for the wait time, anywhere from 2 weeks to 3 months. A lot of it depends on how backlogged they are in the paperwork.

Thank you. I see now: Handgun License - 4 Yr Pers Protect. Again, I have used long guns for almost 30 years. This is my first time dealing with a side arm.

One note... The US Supreme Court may be ruling on our right to conceal and carry in the near future. From Forbes online 2/25/13

"A Gun-Control Battle That Could Actually Damage The Industry Is Escaping Public Attention: Two federal appeals courts last week reviewed the legality behind concealed carry laws. In Denver, the court decided that concealed-carry firearms aren’t protected by the Second Amendment. A thousand miles away in Chicago, the court reached a different decision. It declined to reconsider a ruling that found that state’s ban on concealed carry unconstitutional...Contradictory appeal decisions would raise the likelihood that the matter would reach the Supreme Court. "

Thanks again for the correction and the input.

 

[rlmx]

We have a License to Carry a Handgun. It is NOT a "concealed" carry permit, we are legally allowed to carry openly on our hips just like Barney Fife does.

As for the switch to the LIFETIME license, you cannot renew before its due. So you need to wait. But don't worry, there is no move in Indiana to take away the Lifetime license.

As for the wait time, anywhere from 2 weeks to 3 months. A lot of it depends on how backlogged they are in the paperwork.

Thank you. I see now: Handgun License - 4 Yr Pers Protect. Again, I have used long guns for almost 30 years. This is my first time dealing with a side arm.

One note... The US Supreme Court may be ruling on our right to conceal and carry in the near future. From Forbes online 2/25/13

"A Gun-Control Battle That Could Actually Damage The Industry Is Escaping Public Attention: Two federal appeals courts last week reviewed the legality behind concealed carry laws. In Denver, the court decided that concealed-carry firearms aren’t protected by the Second Amendment. A thousand miles away in Chicago, the court reached a different decision. It declined to reconsider a ruling that found that state’s ban on concealed carry unconstitutional...Contradictory appeal decisions would raise the likelihood that the matter would reach the Supreme Court. "

Thanks again for the correction and the input.

 

[DownByTheTracks]

Do not use lead bullets in your Glock, always use a bullet with some sort of copper jacket or plating.

 

[melensdad]

Do not use lead bullets in your Glock, always use a bullet with some sort of copper jacket or plating.

Yup, that is correct.

Its also why I specified plated or jacketed bullets.

On the other hand, he could buy a LONE WOLF barrel and drop it into his Glock and that would allow him to use cheaper lead bullets. But with a factory Glock barrel, because of the way the rifling is cut, lead bullets are not a real option.

One note... The US Supreme Court may be ruling on our right to conceal and carry in the near future. From Forbes online 2/25/13

Yup, but bear in mind that this is something that overlaps state rights too. While the 10th Circuit ruled against the right to carry, it did not say that states need to comply, it simply means that states, if they choose, may deny the right. But then the state's constitution could come into play as well.

I honestly don't see the 10th Circuit Court ruling have much, if any, effect on our carry rights in Indiana, given the way our rights are written in our State Constitution.

 

[Jeremy1066]

Winchester White Box 115gr FMJ can SOMETIMES be found at Wallyworld or Meijer for about $24/50 and makes very good target ammo. Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST are my preferred personal defense loads.

 

[10-32]

Winchester White Box 115gr FMJ can SOMETIMES be found at Wallyworld or Meijer for about $24/50 and makes very good target ammo. Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST are my preferred personal defense loads.

Wal-mart here is charging $14.85/50ct Winchester or Federal. Federal 100ct is 21.85.

 

[Jeremy1066]

Wal-mart here is charging $14.85/50ct Winchester or Federal. Federal 100ct is 21.85.

Ooops. My bad. I meant $24/100 for Winchester or $19/100 for Federal, although the Federal doesn't show up as often as the Winchester.

 

[7.62]

As far as carry rounds go I personally like the Winchester PDX1 124g +P rounds. As stated before make sure you fire a few boxes of your carry round to make sure your gun likes them and you do as well. There ares tons of other great options for a self defense round as well...I'm just found of the PDX1 line of ammo.

 

[gloxrok]

speer gold dot, winchester ranger t-series, or federal hst are all excellent carry choices, as many others have already said.

 

[WebHobbit]

In 9mm this is what I use and recommend:

Practice:

Most any major brand FMJ in 115-124 will do fine. I usually use (in order of preference):

Remington green box
Federal American Eagle
Winchester white box
PMC

I would MUCH rather use the 124 weight for practice (as that is my carry load weight) but for some reason I've pretty much NEVER seen that weight locally (only 115). Not a huge difference though.


Defense/Carry:

I do not recommend the 147 grain weight in 9mm. There were many failures to expand and cycle reliably early on with this one. Supposedly this has all been fixed/corrected with the newer gen stuff. However there are still good reasons to just NOT use the heavier round:

1) It's non-standard....you certainly will not be finding 147 grain practice (FMJ) rounds very often (if EVER) at Walmart or Rural King or Dicks or most any other cheap local source. Since 147 is a pretty big step from 115/124 it would be enough to throw you off as far as Point of Aim/Point of Impact.

2) It's SLOWER. All other things being equal heavier is slower....and lets face it handguns in general are poor man-stoppers. So I figure it needs all the help it can get on it's way to good expansion.

What I do recommend:

Federal HST in 124 +P flavoring

or

Speer Gold Dot 124 +P

Another thing that bites a lot of new shooters (and a surprising amount of experienced ones) is falling into the trap of buying hollow points in 20 or 25 round boxes. NEVER DO THAT. Now I realize this advice will close the book on buying many of the popular rounds (I think Hornady falls to this) and it will most likely cause you to have to buy ALL your defense ammo online or in some of the BETTER stocking gun shops but it's important. You see the ammo industry pretty much F*@KS over everyone that is NOT Law Enforcement when it comes to defense ammo. They market defense hollow-points to cops in 50 ROUND BOXES marked "law enforcement ONLY" and then they repackage similar or in many cases the exact same thing in 20 or 25 round boxes to be sold at retail. And generally the price is EXACTLY THE SAME OR WITHIN 5 BUCKS.

So I simply refuse to play that game and I buy all my defense ammo from:

Kyle's Gunshop, Inc.

As of this writing he is completely SOLD OUT like most places are...but when he has stock he tends to sell 50 round boxes of the good stuff for 24-30 bucks a box.

I'm sure there are many other source for the so called "Law Enforcement Only" 50 round boxes and I hope other folks will chime in with more linkage. And as far as I know the "LEO ONLY" markings carry no weight of law in Indiana and quite possibly no other states in the US.

 

[cosermann]

Since there has arguably been more development in handgun bullets in the last 25 years than in the previous 200, it might not be the best approach to base one's ammo decisions on 25 year old bullet designs/loads.

The most current recommendations are that you generally want a mid to heavy for caliber bullet to promote penetration.

In 9mm this generally means 124 to 147 gr. All the most modern designs perform well within their intended velocity envelope (which you don't have to worry much about unless you're using a 9mm handgun with a barrel significantly less than 3.5").

Increasing velocity (too much) can actually decrease penetration as it causes more rapid expansion and a corresponding "parachute" effect.

There are lots of factors involved and it's no where near as simple as one might think.

Once again this page represents the latest science on the issue: Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo

This is splitting hairs, but this is the "best" advice available on selecting a defensive load, and it's the sort of approach currently taken by many law enforcement agencies. There are a number "ok" or "good" loads around.

As long as a load is reliable in your handgun, of sufficient accuracy, and penetrates adequately it can work if you do your part and put the bullet where it needs to go.

Penetration is what's most necessary in the handgun self-defense context. Expansion is a bonus, and if it can be achieved without compromising penetration that's great. But if you have to chose between penetration or expansion (ex. as with most 380 acp loads), penetration takes priority.

Whatever you do, don't go nuts trying to pic the absolute best load. Any of the top tier loads are fine. What's most important is what YOU do with it.

So, practice, train, and do whatever you need to do to develop your proficiency with your firearm(s).

 

[chezuki]

As for the switch to the LIFETIME license, you cannot renew before its due. So you need to wait. But don't worry, there is no move in Indiana to take away the Lifetime license.

Actually, you can renew as early as 365 days prior to expiration.

 

[Jeremy1066]

In 9mm this is what I use and recommend:

Practice:

Most any major brand FMJ in 115-124 will do fine. I usually use (in order of preference):

Remington green box
Federal American Eagle
Winchester white box
PMC

I would MUCH rather use the 124 weight for practice (as that is my carry load weight) but for some reason I've pretty much NEVER seen that weight locally (only 115). Not a huge difference though.


Defense/Carry:

I do not recommend the 147 grain weight in 9mm. There were many failures to expand and cycle reliably early on with this one. Supposedly this has all been fixed/corrected with the newer gen stuff. However there are still good reasons to just NOT use the heavier round:

1) It's non-standard....you certainly will not be finding 147 grain practice (FMJ) rounds very often (if EVER) at Walmart or Rural King or Dicks or most any other cheap local source. Since 147 is a pretty big step from 115/124 it would be enough to throw you off as far as Point of Aim/Point of Impact.

2) It's SLOWER. All other things being equal heavier is slower....and lets face it handguns in general are poor man-stoppers. So I figure it needs all the help it can get on it's way to good expansion.

What I do recommend:

Federal HST in 124 +P flavoring

or

Speer Gold Dot 124 +P

Another thing that bites a lot of new shooters (and a surprising amount of experienced ones) is falling into the trap of buying hollow points in 20 or 25 round boxes. NEVER DO THAT. Now I realize this advice will close the book on buying many of the popular rounds (I think Hornady falls to this) and it will most likely cause you to have to buy ALL your defense ammo online or in some of the BETTER stocking gun shops but it's important. You see the ammo industry pretty much F*@KS over everyone that is NOT Law Enforcement when it comes to defense ammo. They market defense hollow-points to cops in 50 ROUND BOXES marked "law enforcement ONLY" and then they repackage similar or in many cases the exact same thing in 20 or 25 round boxes to be sold at retail. And generally the price is EXACTLY THE SAME OR WITHIN 5 BUCKS.

So I simply refuse to play that game and I buy all my defense ammo from:

Kyle's Gunshop, Inc.

As of this writing he is completely SOLD OUT like most places are...but when he has stock he tends to sell 50 round boxes of the good stuff for 24-30 bucks a box.

I'm sure there are many other source for the so called "Law Enforcement Only" 50 round boxes and I hope other folks will chime in with more linkage. And as far as I know the "LEO ONLY" markings carry no weight of law in Indiana and quite possibly no other states in the US.

I agree with SOME of this, but not very much. True, you won't find 147gr target loads at Wallyworld or Meijer. But if you go online to buy carry ammo, why not do it for target ammo as well?
The theory (or proof) of 147gr hollow points not expanding is 25 years old. I have never seen a test where 147 gr Gold Dot or HST failed to expand. Never. What I have seen, is test after test that shows a 147gr hollow point penetrating deeper than its counterparts in a lighter load (all else being equal). I would trade an extra inch of penetration over an extra couple hundredths of an inch expansion every day of the week.
In any pistol I've ever shot, the recoil of a 147gr load is noticeably less than a 124+p or 127+p+ round every time. This means faster follow up shots with greater accuracy (for me). To each his own, but I only carry 147gr Gold Dots or 147gr HST for self defense.