Indiana Constitutional Carry-Summer Study thread (2017)

[jamil]

He is a partner at a medium/large law firm. He is comfortable.

Go make your argument. He is not "the enemy" but he is not a "true believer". He will need to be persuaded.

Read the footnotes of the wiki article, get inside his head and his country club stances. He does not want anything radical. ConCarry is nothing radical. Other states are doing it with no problems.

GOP is perceived as law enforcement friendly. Post-Pinner (he knows the case) ConCarry does nothing radical. LE/citizen interactions will not be different with ConCarry.

The funding, this is his MLR (main line of resistance). ConCarry will take no money away and could even increased funding as happened in Arizona as more people got licenses for travel outside the state. Indiana will not let funding decline to law enforcement so Democrats can cry "soft on crime" in November (a real fear of losing his supermajority).

1. It will not hurt him politically.
2. It will not impact day to day life in the state (ie it is not radical).

Oh. I can write some ****. Will he read it?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Okay. Fine. But what about the other powerful people telling him to kill it?

What "powerful people" are these?

 

[Trigger Time]

Write Bosma. Do it now.

Phone calls are great. But written letters and postcards are even better as they are tangible.

Call your buddies together, pass out postcards, everyone sits and writes Bosma as they drink their coffee, tea, beer.

The House leadership is the problem. The Speaker of the House is the big muckety-muck in the House. We need to write Bosma.

But but but everyone said bosma is so on board and helpful? Yeah i,know he's a hack and NO FRIEND to the 2nd amendment. I get,tired of saying this over and over for the last 4 damn years. BOSMA NEEDS TO GO.
Write that son of a *****

 

[T.Lex]

1) I agree with KF that Bosma is the key.

B) After people write Bosma, writing their own representative/state senator is a good idea, too. Bosma receives his power from the other legislators that make him the Keymaster. That's a numbers game. If Bosma is on the "wrong" side of a group large enough to take away the key (whether that would happens matters less than if it COULD happen), then he is more likely to pay attention.

III) I still believe the reality is that actual action on this issue is less important to the legislators than the appearance of action. If Lucas REALLY wants to move this ahead (and I think he does), he needs to have the leverage provided by (B) above and be willing to push it. He, or someone like him, needs to say that if Bosma doesn't bring it to a vote, they will make a run at the Speakership and would have the votes to get there. Yes, there is a HUGE risk to that; it would likely be considered disloyal.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

1) I agree with KF that Bosma is the key.

B) After people write Bosma, writing their own representative/state senator is a good idea, too. Bosma receives his power from the other legislators that make him the Keymaster. That's a numbers game. If Bosma is on the "wrong" side of a group large enough to take away the key (whether that would happens matters less than if it COULD happen), then he is more likely to pay attention.

III) I still believe the reality is that actual action on this issue is less important to the legislators than the appearance of action. If Lucas REALLY wants to move this ahead (and I think he does), he needs to have the leverage provided by (B) above and be willing to push it. He, or someone like him, needs to say that if Bosma doesn't bring it to a vote, they will make a run at the Speakership and would have the votes to get there. Yes, there is a HUGE risk to that; it would likely be considered disloyal.

A man of his age and position, Bosma is thinking about the plaque he is going to get at the Statehouse and which room they will name after him and whether the portrait of him shows the double chin or not.

He does not fear a run at his Speakership (not going to happen), he fears rocking the boat. Lucas and true believers need to rock the boat to break loose the moorings.

Meanwhile, we need to be writing Bosma.

 

[jamil]

What "powerful people" are these?

I recall a discussion, maybe in this thread, about Pence and other concerned established Republicans not wanting to rock the boat. And then there's the top-cops. I'm not going to rule out getting this conflated with something else. It's been awhile since it was discussed.

A man of his age and position, Bosma is thinking about the plaque he is going to get at the Statehouse and which room they will name after him and whether the portrait of him shows the double chin or not.

He does not fear a run at his Speakership (not going to happen), he fears rocking the boat. Lucas and true believers need to rock the boat to break loose the moorings.

Meanwhile, we need to be writing Bosma.

I'll take your word for it. But I'm skeptical of its usefulness. I'll do that and write my own reps.

 

[KellyinAvon]

This just in, 7 September meeting moved to the House Chambers!! Once again in the BIG room, discussion topics from the 22 August meeting have been added to the "gunshow loophole" topic.

Hopefully I'm not sitting among the Moms in Need of Some Action crowd or that crazy woman this time.


https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2017/committees/judiciary_and_public_policy

 

[actaeon277]

This just in, 7 September meeting moved to the House Chambers!! Once again in the BIG room, discussion topics from the 22 August meeting have been added to the "gunshow loophole" topic.

Hopefully I'm not sitting among the Moms in Need of Some Action crowd or that crazy woman this time.


https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2017/committees/judiciary_and_public_policy

Bring a sign that has an arrow, and says "I'm NOT with stupid".

Or

"I like guns"

 

[KellyinAvon]

Bring a sign that has an arrow, and says "I'm NOT with stupid".

Or

"I like guns"

I was wearing my Glock Perfection polo last meeting, Team Glock at the next one. I don't think they are that observant.

 

[brotherbill3]

for now this appears to be a better date for me; Going to try to make it - not sure I can stay for 5 hrs again. ... ugh.

 

[actaeon277]

I was wearing my Glock Perfection polo last meeting, Team Glock at the next one. I don't think they are that observant.

That's why you need the sign.

 

[chipbennett]

I'm going to be... (*checks cruise itinerary*) in Key West on 7 September...

I really would like to make one of these meetings.

 

[KellyinAvon]

I'm going to be... (*checks cruise itinerary*) in Key West on 7 September...

I really would like to make one of these meetings.

You should be back by 12 October...

 

[chipbennett]

You should be back by 12 October...

True, though I'll likely still be out of town (for work, rather than for fun).

I may see if I can adjust my schedule to be back for it.

 

[JeremiahJohnson]

7 September...gun show loophole...I hope Mr. Relford will be there to articulate the absurdity of this position. Facts. They're messy.

 

[2A_Tom]

Actually, Gun show loophole might be more in Mr. Freeman's wheel house. He has given a lot of info about Indiana's UBC here.

 

[jamil]

7 September...gun show loophole...I hope Mr. Relford will be there to articulate the absurdity of this position. Facts. They're messy.

Loophole implies a legal way to circumvent a law. Dealers still must follow the law. At most there may be some grey area in how to define dealers, but that's still not a loophole. People do get busted for selling to people when they fall within the defined limits of what is a dealer.

The fact that a legal private sale happens to transact in the proximity of a gun show is not a loophole at all. That same legal transaction could easily take place in a Walmart parking lot. It's just that a gun show creates more opportunities for private transactions because there are people congregated in the space and time who are thinking about participating in that market.

 

[T.Lex]

Wait.

I thought the gunshow loophole was what allowed these places to extort large sums of money from people. It was a loophole to the enforcement of the theft statutes.

It sounds like I may have misunderstood.

 

[JeremiahJohnson]

The way the "loophole" is reported by our crack team of journalists is some dealers sell at gun shows without a background check. They even have investigative reporters go to gun shows and secretly report people buying guns at a gun show without a background check. Anti-2A people swear they've seen them and it's a huge problem! (purple implied)

 

[KellyinAvon]

Tuesday bump: back in the big room on Thursday