Colin Kaepernick protests the Anthem

[indiucky]

It's a distraction for the nattering masses so that the Administration can focus on making real changes without worrying so much about the optics of doing what needs to be done. Real changes are happening in the bureaucracy, tax reform proposal being announced today, and the SHARE Act is on the move. The suppressor aspect would not have a chance in hell if the left was paying attention to that instead of silly stuff like the NFL. Just like a magician, Trump is distracting you while he does something else.

It's amazing how few people get that....I love it.....

 

[Kutnupe14]

So if their feelings and beliefs don't match up with yours their service is somehow illegitimate? Perhaps you should take up speaking to veteran's groups and active duty to school us on what their/our service was all about.

And you think I wouldn't, that's the funny part.

 

[Kutnupe14]

My wife spent 18 months on a Navajo reservation as a teacher before moving back to Indiana. To them, she was just another belegana (it's a derogatory term for white people). The vast majority teach their children to hate all white people and that they are all evil. Look how it's helped them.

Now, if any "race" has a reason to hate whites it's definitely the American Indians. We brought famine, disease, stole their land, slaughtered them and stuffed them onto almost unlivable land. But all this hate is not helping them at all. It doesn't help anyone. The constant division and hatred that has been spread for hundreds of years on all sides needs to stop. But unfortunately its not allowed to be talked about in its entirety and we sure as hell aren't allowed to talk about the actual problems and their root causes.

So, is my island ready yet? I'm done with society.

I thought Native Americans had no concept of land ownership, and when white people tried to pay for land, the Native Americans took those payments (committing fraud), and laughed thinking "no one can own the land." And then some guy put up barbed wire, and they got so upset they were being held to their agreement that they started getting violent.

 

[indiucky]

I thought Native Americans had no concept of land ownership, and when white people tried to pay for land, the Native Americans took those payments (committing fraud), and laughed thinking "no one can own the land." And then some guy put up barbed wire, and they got so upset they were being held to their agreement that they started getting violent.

There was an element of truth to that in the east....The Quakers probably dealt the fairest with the natives with the French a close second......The natives usually didn't get violent until whites started crossing the Proclamation line of 1763 and bringing their families with them...Traders and long hunters are one thing...Family groups with plows, children, dogs, and seed are quite another.......

A Speech Given by Dragging Canoe



- Chief Dragging Canoe, Chickamauga Tsalagi (Cherokee) 1775



"Whole Indian Nations have melted away like snowballs in the sun before the white man's advance. They leave scarcely a name of our people except those wrongly recorded by their destroyers. Where are the Delawares? They have been reduced to a mere shadow of their former greatness. We had hoped that the white men would not be willing to travel beyond the mountains. Now that hope is gone. They have passed the mountains, and have settled upon Tsalagi (Cherokee) land. They wish to have that usurpation sanctioned by treaty. When that is gained, the same encroaching spirit will lead them upon other land of the Tsalagi (Cherokees). New cessions will be asked. Finally the whole country, which the Tsalagi (Cherokees) and their fathers have so long occupied, will be demanded, and the remnant of the Ani Yvwiya, The Real People, once so great and formidable, will be compelled to seek refuge in some distant wilderness. There they will be permitted to stay only a short while, until they again behold the advancing banners of the same greedy host. Not being able to point out any further retreat for the miserable Tsalagi (Cherokees), the extinction of the whole race will be proclaimed. Should we not therefore run all risks, and incur all consequences, rather than to submit to further loss of our country? Such treaties may be alright for men who are too old to hunt or fight. As for me, I have my young warriors about me. We will hold our land."



Some background on the Quakers dealing with the Indians...

[h=1]Quakers and Indians[/h]Posted on February 19, 2011 by Ojibwa
( – promoted by navajo)
A new religious movement began in England in the late 1640s. The Religious Society of Friends, commonly known as Quakers, felt that it was possible for individuals to have a direct experience of Jesus Christ without the mediation of clergy. In addition, they believed in the spiritual equality of women. These two things made it easier for Native Americans, with a shamanistic and egalitarian background, to accept the Quakers among them as missionaries.
In 1681, King Charles II of England granted a land charter to William Penn. The friendly relations between the Quakers and American Indians began when William Penn signed a peace treaty with Tammany, the leader of the Lenni Lenape (Delaware) nation.
In 1755, the Quakers established the Friendly Association for Regaining and Preserving Peace with the Indians by Pacific Measures. In establishing this charity, the Quakers hoped to return to the Indian-European relations that had been established by William Penn. Unlike other European charities at this time, the new Quaker charity spent its funds on Indians. This caused many non-Quaker Europeans to resent the association. The new charity was intended to be as conspicuous as possible-to both Indians and Europeans-and therefore serve as a shining example of how intercultural relations could be conducted.
In 1760, the Munsee prophet Papounhan and 30 of his followers visited Philadelphia and asked to see the Friends (Quakers) about religion. Unlike other Christian groups, the Quakers did not condemn Indian religions. While in the city, the Indians regularly attended meetings for worship in the Quakers’ Greater Meetinghouse.
In 1765, Quaker missionary John Woolman preached to the Munsee and Delaware. He felt that the Delaware were already communing with the divine light inside them and he sought spiritual tutelage from the Indians. He wrote:

“in mine own eyes I appeared inferior to many amongst the Indians.”​

In 1795, the Quakers appointed a committee for the civilization and welfare of Indians. The plan was to introduce among the Indians what the Europeans felt were the necessary arts of civilization, including animal husbandry and the mechanical arts. The following year, the Quakers began their Indian plan by sending tools to most of the Indian nations of the eastern United States.
Following their Indian plan, five Quakers arrived at the Seneca town of Jenuchshadago in 1795. The Seneca, under the leadership of Cornplanter, were hungry because floods and frost had damaged their corn harvest. After consideration of the Quaker request to live among them and teach them, Cornplanter told them:

“Brothers, you never wished our lands, you never wished any part of our lands, therefore we are determined to try to learn your ways.”​

Unlike other Christian missionaries, the Society of Friends was willing to accept the theological validity of Indian religious experiences. The Quakers concentrated on teaching some of the young people how to read and write in English and to teach men and women modern farming techniques. They incorporated moral advice into their practical instruction. In this way, the Quakers attempted to persuade the Seneca to be sober, clean, punctual, industrious: in other words, to take up the Protestant ethic without, necessarily, becoming Protestants.
In 1808, the Quaker missionary William Kirk supervised the Ohio Shawnee as they cleared 400 acres and planted new crops such as potatoes, cabbage, and turnips. The Shawnee purchased breeding stock hoping that hogs and cattle would eventually supply them with the meat they used to get through hunting.
While Kirk was successful in teaching the Shawnee the European methods of farming, he was lax with his paperwork. Having failed to file financial statements with Washington, his mission was terminated by the government. When Kirk left, the Shawnee lost their primary source of technical advice and their experiment in agriculture waned.
In 1827, Seneca leader Red Jacket traveled to New York City to talk with the Quakers about providing aid for his people. Red Jacket trusted few persons other than the Quakers, who could not be intimidated and who were quick to expose a fraud. However, the Quakers were involved with helping the Onondaga and did not have any resources with which they could respond to the Seneca request. Two years later, Red Jacket repeated his request and this time the Quakers provided the Seneca with both farm equipment and sound advice.
The heyday of Quaker involvement with Indians came with President Ulysses Grant’s 1869 Peace Policy in which the federal government turned over the administration of Indian reservation to Christian missionary groups.
In Oklahoma, the Comanche and Kiowa were assigned to the Quakers and the army was removed from the reservation.
In Nebraska, the six reservations were placed in the care of the Hicksite Quakers, the liberal branch of the Society of Friends. A part of the Quaker plan to destroy the political and social structure of the Pawnee was the elimination of the Pawnee scouts, a group which had a long history of serving the United States army. As pacifists, the Quaker brotherhood made no allowance for the Pawnee culture, traditions, or experiences in which war experiences were glorified. Ignoring the reality of drought and grasshoppers, the Quakers saw farming as the way to convert the Pawnee.
The first Quaker Indian agent for the Big Blue Reservation (Otoe-Missouria) in Nebraska and Kansas, found 450 Otoe living in a 25-acre village which contained 30 earthlodges. The Otoe continued to use their traditional agricultural practices and to do some hunting. While the Quaker agents came with good intentions, they failed to understand the organization of the tribe. Therefore they disrupted the traditional leadership pattern, and contributed to tribal factionalism.
In Nebraska, the Quakers assumed control of the Omaha reservation. The tribal chiefs asked that the funds for the Presbyterian boarding school be withdrawn and that two day schools be established. The Quakers treated the Indians as spiritual equals but cultural inferiors who must learn European ways or perish. They stressed allotment of tribal lands and the creation of individual farms.
Overall, the Quaker experiences with the Indians during the 18th and 19th centuries were good with regard to religious tolerance. Many of the Indians, particularly those in the east, found it easy to incorporate Quaker spiritual concepts into their own religion. The Longhouse Religion, founded by Seneca religious leader Handsome Lake, for example, seems to have incorporated a number of Quaker teachings. On the other, the emphasis on war honors among the Plains tribes created some problems for the pacifistic Quakers.
During the 19th century, the Quakers were hampered by an ethnocentrism which saw the Euro-American way of life as superior to the Indian way of life. While Indian religious practices were tolerated, there was an emphasis on changing other aspects of Indian culture, including government and family.


This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged History, Indians 101, missionaries, Quakers, Teachingby Ojibwa. Bookmark the permalink.[FONT=&quot][h=2]2 THOUGHTS ON “QUAKERS AND INDIANS”[/h][/FONT]

 

[AmmoManAaron]

I've never watched hockey, but it looks like I'm going to be giving the NHL a chance.

After Mass Anthem Protests in the NFL, The NHL Responds in Its Own Way

 

[rhino]

There was an element of truth to that in the east....The Quakers probably dealt the fairest with the natives with the French a close second......The natives usually didn't get violent until whites started crossing the Proclamation line of 1763 and bringing their families with them...Traders and long hunters are one thing...Family groups with plows, children, dogs, and seed are quite another.......

[FONT=&amp]
[/FONT]

I believe that . . . with regard to the specific tribes they encountered in that area.

It's not a great idea ascribe the same traits, motives, behaviors, customs, inclination toward either passive or overtly hostile responses to contact, and other characteristics to all of the many groups of American Indians that inhabited the Americas over time. They're as diverse as any other "grouping" of people.


PROPOSAL: since the world has a set of internationally known symbols (such as those for men's and women's restrooms), I say that we adopt the silhouette of an NFL players purposely taking a knee during the National Anthem as the international symbol of an American Douche Bag.

Printcraft: this assignment is for you.

 

[Birds Away]

And you think I wouldn't, that's the funny part.

I don't feel myself qualified to lecture that audience on much of anything. I'm not surprised that you do.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I don't feel myself qualified to lecture that audience on much of anything. I'm not surprised that you do.

Don't be surprised. You made a suggestion, and stated I would be open to it. I'm not surprised that you feel yourself unqualified to lecture on anything. You probably haven't given a lecture before. It's good to know one limitations. Fortunately for me, I don't subscribe to your limitations.

 

[jamil]

I pee farther than you do. Well I used to. Before the BPH.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

You still don't understand how and why he got elected in the first place.

I have my theories.

This:

NFL Protests: Trump Is Right | National Review

(ETA: unlike lefty echo-chamber publications, the NR has a diversity of thought... and debates issues of the day)

 

[printcraft]

Don't be surprised. You made a suggestion, and stated I would be open to it. I'm not surprised that you feel yourself unqualified to lecture on anything. You probably haven't given a lecture before. It's good to know one limitations. Fortunately for me, I don't subscribe to your limitations.

lol

 

[Birds Away]

Don't be surprised. You made a suggestion, and stated I would be open to it. I'm not surprised that you feel yourself unqualified to lecture on anything. You probably haven't given a lecture before. It's good to know one limitations. Fortunately for me, I don't subscribe to your limitations.

Actually I've spoken to large groups on many occasions. It goes hand in hand with long military service. However I would not feel qualified to tell veterans or active duty personnel the meaning of their service. I could speak to what their service means to me but I could never be so arrogant to suppose myself qualified to tell them what they should think about their own service or anyone else's. To me it's purely a matter of respect for them, which you obviously don't share.

 

[printcraft]

PROPOSAL: since the world has a set of internationally known symbols (such as those for men's and women's restrooms), I say that we adopt the silhouette of an NFL players purposely taking a knee during the National Anthem as the international symbol of an American Douche Bag.

Printcraft: this assignment is for you.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Actually I've spoken to large groups on many occasions. It goes hand in hand with long military service. However I would not feel qualified to tell veterans or active duty personnel the meaning of their service. I could speak to what their service means to me but I could never be so arrogant to suppose myself qualified to tell them what they should think about their own service or anyone else's. To me it's purely a matter of respect for them, which you obviously don't share.

Soooooo....

I don't feel myself qualified to lecture that audience on much of anything. I'm not surprised that you do.

You're just trolling. You don't feel qualified to tell some people the meaning of one thing (service) but you feel completely qualified to tell some other people the meaning of something else (protesters).
So you admit that, in your unrecognized hypocrisy, you are arrogant to supposed yourself qualified to tell protesters what and how they should protest, and the meaning of their protest.

Gotcha. Moving on.

 

[bwframe]

DirecTV offering refunds on NFL packages over anthem protests (reports) | syracuse.com

...DirecTV is offering refunds on NFL Sunday Ticket packages to some customers who complained after seeing hundreds of athletes "take the knee" during the "Star-Spangled Banner" this past weekend. According to the New York Post, the satellite service does not typically return money for the subscription after the NFL season starts, but some customers reported receiving refunds after saying they were upset by the anthem protests.

"I want to spend my money somewhere where it's gonna be appreciated," a former subscriber from Texas told the Post. "I'm paying for a product that should not include that kind of anti-American sentiment."...

 

[AmmoManAaron]

Taya Kyle calls out the NFL in style and with great grace.

American sniper's wife Taya Kyle: An open letter to the NFL | Fox News

 

[jamil]

Soooooo....



You're just trolling. You don't feel qualified to tell some people the meaning of one thing (service) but you feel completely qualified to tell some other people the meaning of something else (protesters).
So you admit that, in your unrecognized hypocrisy, you are arrogant to supposed yourself qualified to tell protesters what and how they should protest, and the meaning of their protest.

Gotcha. Moving on.

Well, hold on there. It's not like Kaepernick never told anyone why he's protesting that way.

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color..."

The country. The whole ****ing thing. All of it. Not just a little bit of it. ALL OF IT oppresses black people. Yeah. I think I feel qualified to tell him that's not a very accurate way to protest the treatment of some blacks by some white people.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Marie Tillman equally graceful in caling out "our leaders."

"The very action of self expression and the freedom to speak from one's heart — no matter those views — is what Pat and so many other Americans have given their lives for. Even if they didn't always agree with those views. It is my sincere hope that our leaders both understand and learn from the lessons of Pat's life and death, and also those of so many other brave Americans."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...politicize-pat-in-effort-to-divide/106005404/

 

[Birds Away]

Yes, I've lost interest. I fully support the players' right to peacefully protest. I also support the owners' rights to, if they choose, discipline employees whose actions are, in their minds, contrary to the company's best interests. Truthfully I hope this somehow opens a wider discussion about the issue in question. But in order to get to the root of some of these issues people are going to have to be willing to hear things they might not like to hear. But if that doesn't happen this will be all for nothing.

Soooooo....



You're just trolling. You don't feel qualified to tell some people the meaning of one thing (service) but you feel completely qualified to tell some other people the meaning of something else (protesters).
So you admit that, in your unrecognized hypocrisy, you are arrogant to supposed yourself qualified to tell protesters what and how they should protest, and the meaning of their protest.

Gotcha. Moving on.

Not hardly. I've stated before, and I will again, that I support the players' right to peacefully protest. You're awfully quick to label people hypocrites. Perhaps some introspection is in order.

 

[HoughMade]

Marie Tillman equally graceful in caling out "our leaders."


https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...politicize-pat-in-effort-to-divide/106005404/

So they should protest Donald Trump. Why is this so hard to understand?

It's like blindly shooting into a crowd because there is one guy in it who is a threat.