Breaking: Truck Plows into Berlin Christmas Market

[Kutnupe14]

(Italian accent) Hey, that guy look a lot like that guy in the picture on the news and at roll call this morning. (Italian accent) I have no problem with this. Police maintaining SA and identifying bad guys is what we want them to do. Randomly demanding ID for no reason? That's a different situation and I do have a problem with this.

Roll Call? I think it's Bruschetta call in Italy.

 

[churchmouse]

I can sympathize with this, I've been there until relatively recently. People are people. We're all hypocrites, egotists, snooty, aloof, closed minded, etc.---to one extent of another, we all are. The people you'll find in any church are simply a diagonal slice of humanity and are no diffeerent. While I'll readily admit there are times, in some churches, the resonance of some weakness or another can grow to the point it's off putting and destructive to the congregation and/or new comers, we must be careful that we don't confuse the message with the people we find ourselves trying to learn about it and let "one or two bad apples" get in our way. There is value in worshiping in groups. You may find yourself at odds with the doctrine of one denomination or another. Or you may not like the style of music in one church over another. Or just got busy (or lazy) and fell out of the church-going habit. Or it might just be, as in your case, you got fed up with the particular people...but I have found it more enlightening and I've gotten closer to God when we started going to church on a regular basis. Some of the stuff I read in the bible are frankly confusing and sometimes seemingly contradictory. Having others that are more knowledgeable explain those problems has helped me immensely. Having a church family is another blessing that I'm really just now discovering. It takes time to build those relationships but I can see it becoming more and more fruitful with each passing week. It's hard being the stranger, all of a sudden showing up -- at least it was for me (I'm a very introverted person by nature). And I'm as set in my ways as much as the next person. So I know what it's like to decide: today's the day, I'm going to start going to church again. But it's worth it. Especially if you find the group of people that you can feel like family around.

I have mentioned in passing in the forum that I am a cancer survivor. In remission since late 02. I was on a 3 year time frame and by that clock I would be long gone.
Long story short my faith had been bruised by the loss of my oldest son on my "B" day 2002. Not at all looking at believing in much of anything. Then 3 weeks after his passing I was diagnosed stage 4 Non-Hodgkin's lymphoma. Look it up. There is no absolute cure or was none in 02.
3 years. It will change the way you look at the world around you. I was really in the tank on Faith.

My darling spouse and my sister put me on some prayer circles 2 of which are world wide.
I started getting letters and calls from people I did not know and will most likely never meet. Asking how I was doing and was my mind in the right place to face the next hurdles. Church was never mentioned but Christ was. This was a regular event. My mind was moving back into the light and I was being positive no matter the outcome.

Sept. 02 I was told my situation had improved and remission was the word.
The prayers continued and I am walking upright among you. 14 years out.
The power of prayer is all I can account for this.

Yes, I talk with Christ every day and will until I can no longer.

Just explaining how my minds eye sees these things.

To commit these terrible acts in the name of any deity is just wrong.

 

[Sylvain]

Yes. With the knowledge after the fact that this was the droid they were looking for, in the US this could easily have been a voluntary interaction at 0300 where the officers thought the individual matched the description of the international man of mystery, so asked for ID.

In Euroland, where the rules are a bit different, police often have the ability to ask for ID for no reason.

It does appear that intel was gathered that traced Amri's path from Germany to Italy by train. So that would help with reasonable suspicion.

Just like in the US, they can ask, doesn't mean you have to show them anything.
In some EU countries you are required to carry ID at all times, in others you are not.

 

[actaeon277]

I could be wrong, but... they can stop you and require identification in most of the US.
Don't they just require (at least in Indiana) that you are stopped for an infraction of an infraction or ordinance>
IC 34-28-5-3.5

Granted, they can't just go around stopping everyone on the street, or everyone of a similar racial background, but if an officer suspects you of being a murder suspect, he can stop you and ask for ID.
If you turn out to be guilty of it, I guess the officers case is made.

But I could be wrong.
Educate me please.

 

[actaeon277]

Indiana Code 2016 - Indiana General Assembly, 2017 Session

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I have mentioned in passing in the forum that I am a cancer survivor. In remission since late 02. I was on a 3 year time frame and by that clock I would be long gone.
Long story short my faith had been bruised by the loss of my oldest son on my "B" day 2002. Not at all looking at believing in much of anything. Then 3 weeks after his passing I was diagnosed stage 4 Non-Hodgkin's lymphoma. Look it up. There is no absolute cure or was none in 02.
3 years. It will change the way you look at the world around you. I was really in the tank on Faith.

My darling spouse and my sister put me on some prayer circles 2 of which are world wide.
I started getting letters and calls from people I did not know and will most likely never meet. Asking how I was doing and was my mind in the right place to face the next hurdles. Church was never mentioned but Christ was. This was a regular event. My mind was moving back into the light and I was being positive no matter the outcome.

Sept. 02 I was told my situation had improved and remission was the word.
The prayers continued and I am walking upright among you. 14 years out.
The power of prayer is all I can account for this.

Yes, I talk with Christ every day and will until I can no longer.

Just explaining how my minds eye sees these things.

To commit these terrible acts in the name of any deity is just wrong.

What a great testimony, CM!

You have been blessed and your work is not yet done on this earth!

 

[Joe G]

I have mentioned in passing in the forum that I am a cancer survivor. In remission since late 02. I was on a 3 year time frame and by that clock I would be long gone.
Long story short my faith had been bruised by the loss of my oldest son on my "B" day 2002. Not at all looking at believing in much of anything. Then 3 weeks after his passing I was diagnosed stage 4 Non-Hodgkin's lymphoma. Look it up. There is no absolute cure or was none in 02.
3 years. It will change the way you look at the world around you. I was really in the tank on Faith.

My darling spouse and my sister put me on some prayer circles 2 of which are world wide.
I started getting letters and calls from people I did not know and will most likely never meet. Asking how I was doing and was my mind in the right place to face the next hurdles. Church was never mentioned but Christ was. This was a regular event. My mind was moving back into the light and I was being positive no matter the outcome.

Sept. 02 I was told my situation had improved and remission was the word.
The prayers continued and I am walking upright among you. 14 years out.
The power of prayer is all I can account for this.

Yes, I talk with Christ every day and will until I can no longer.

Just explaining how my minds eye sees these things.

To commit these terrible acts in the name of any deity is just wrong.

Amazing blessing CM. His words can heal all. Merry Christmas to you and your family.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I could be wrong, but... they can stop you and require identification in most of the US.
Don't they just require (at least in Indiana) that you are stopped for an infraction of an infraction or ordinance>
IC 34-28-5-3.5

Granted, they can't just go around stopping everyone on the street, or everyone of a similar racial background, but if an officer suspects you of being a murder suspect, he can stop you and ask for ID.
If you turn out to be guilty of it, I guess the officers case is made.

But I could be wrong.
Educate me please.

They can require ID for ordinance/infractions. You can provide it verbally name/dob/address or by DL/ID card. That only applies to ordinance/infractions though. Ticketable not arrestable offenses. If you are stopped for suspicion of misdemeanor or felony there is no requirement to ID.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

 

[churchmouse]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

Amazing.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

TERRORIST LIVES MATTER!!!!!

 

[Trigger Time]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

It's the new ingo.

 

[T.Lex]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

Wait wut? Is this happening in a different thread? Who is doing such a thing?

 

[Trigger Time]

Wait wut? Is this happening in a different thread? Who is doing such a thing?

Give it time.

 

[T.Lex]

I guess in the context of some sort of natural rights argument, that might make sense - if someone was saying there's a natural right to not be asked for papers by police.

From what I can tell, the Italian officers were well within their laws to approach and ask. Even without that, dude drew first and was outgunned. Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

I guess in the context of some sort of natural rights argument, that might make sense - if someone was saying there's a natural right to not be asked for papers by police.

From what I can tell, the Italian officers were well within their laws to approach and ask. Even without that, dude drew first and was outgunned. Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind.

If one of our Italian INGO members could provide us with the appropriate Italian Code (I.C.) on the topic of stopping someone to ask for their papers, I sure would appreciate it. Applying Indiana, or any other US state, law to an incident that occurred in Italy just ain't gonna fly.

 

[actaeon277]

Lol, *****ing about the locating and termination of a terror suspect because his rights might have been violated.

Amazing.

Actually, we were not *****ing about the rights of the terrorist. Read it again. We were comparing what can happen there, verse what can happen here, in regards to what police can do.
I think it's a valid question. Our laws are not Europe's laws.

 

[actaeon277]

If one of our Italian INGO members could provide us with the appropriate Italian Code (I.C.) on the topic of stopping someone to ask for their papers, I sure would appreciate it. Applying Indiana, or any other US state, law to an incident that occurred in Italy just ain't gonna fly.

Is it wrong for us to wonder how things work here in such a situation?
Or are we not supposed to question things, wonder how stuff works?

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

"If it saves just one life..."

(Italian accent) Hey, that guy look a lot like that guy in the picture on the news and at roll call this morning. (Italian accent) I have no problem with this. Police maintaining SA and identifying bad guys is what we want them to do. Randomly demanding ID for no reason? That's a different situation and I do have a problem with this.

Actually, we were not *****ing about the rights of the terrorist. Read it again. We were comparing what can happen there, verse what can happen here, in regards to what police can do.
I think it's a valid question. Our laws are not Europe's laws.

Is it wrong for us to wonder how things work here in such a situation?
Or are we not supposed to question things, wonder how stuff works?

It wasn't you I was referring to, and it wasn't brought up the way you presented it. See above.

 

[OakRiver]

If you ever wanted a case study in the ignorance of journalists, and fake news, I've been watching NBC and ABC news at my mother-in-law's house and both outlets keep asking how the attacker could cross borders without being detected. Any journalist with a passing familiarity of the EU should know that there is no passport control within Europe.