Are you one of the all talk and no action people?

[Michiana]

The Loss of Gun Rights​

Gun Owners Are All Bark and no Bite! ​

By Ralph Weller​

Editor, GunNewsDaily.com​

March 3, 2003 - It has been suspected for quite some time that gun owners were generally all mouth and no action. But, we really didn't understand the gravity of the situation until we received an email from John Brantuk, 2002 candidate for the 56th Assembly District in Southern California. John is upset, and he has every right to be.


John had a shot of winning his district had he received the pro-gun vote. Southern Californians don't need to be told how pro-Second Amendment John is. Suffice it to say, he's one of those rare types who makes protecting our Second Amendment rights a top priority in his personal and public life. But, the information he sent in his email is the type of information that makes the hearts soar of gun grabber Don Perata and other liberals of his ilk in Sacramento. It is the kind of information liberals know about, but very few pro-gun types are willing to acknowledge. So who got the pro-gun vote instead of John Brantuk? The answer is most disappointing.

John took a look at a list of people that regularly attended gun shows in his district. He compared the attendee list to voter registration lists to determine how many of the 12,000 gun show attendees were registered to vote.

Do you want to guess the results? Would you say only half are registered? You would be considered an eternal optimist if that was your guess. How about 30%? Well, you're getting closer, but you still have a long, long way to go. How about 10%. No, you're still too high. No... I'm not kidding. Try about 670 people. That's a whopping 5.6% of gun show attendees are registered to vote. Now, of those 670, an optimistic number of those who voted would probably range at about 50%. That means of the 12,000 gun show attendees only about 335 probably voted. Ok, that's being a little harsh. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and assume that all 670 voted. Somehow inflating the number won't make most feel all that much better about the whole thing.

The problem is, there is no pro-gun vote in California. John didn't get the pro-gun vote, but neither did anyone else! It doesn't exist because the overwhelming majority of gun owners don't vote. And the liberals know it and act upon it with impunity. They don't fear California gun owners! Why would they? Gun owners certainly won't vote them out of office!
Are John Brantuk's results indicative of the rest of California? Sure they are. In fact, most professional pollsters use around 1000 people to achieve very accurate results. John had 12,000 gun owners on a list and registered voting lists that simply don't lie. This is pure data. Not thoughts, not polls, not desires. It's the real thing, and unfortunately it is fact!

The bottom line is gun owners could own California if they vote. John Brantuk would be in the state assembly this very day protecting gun owner's rights along with dozens of other newly elected pro-gun legislators. Instead, gun owners lament the demise of Second Amendment rights and take NO ACTION to resolve it. Gun owners are the problem in California. They're all bark and no bite.

Gun owners avail themselves of the right to participate in freedom of speech on the net, but do nothing to preserve it. They complain endlessly about erosion of Second Amendment rights, but do nothing to change it. Gun owners claim they'll have to pry their guns from their 'cold dead hands' before allowing them to be confiscated. But, gun owners don't vote because they're afraid to be on a government list? California gun owners aren't scaring anyone with their bravado, least of all liberal politicians.

If gun owners can't demand their rights in the voting booth, it is easily assumed they'll fold like the paper tiger they're perceived to be when they come knocking for their guns. On the other hand, those who do vote deserve a medal because they're a rare breed of people. Very rare as the numbers go. They are so out of the mainstream they could almost be classified as a radical fringe group. Those who don't vote deserve a bigger medal hung around they're neck and a short plank into the Pacific because that's all they're worth... fish food.

A lot of people think erroneously that California is hopeless because liberals outnumber conservatives. It's clear gun owners outnumber themselves. Gun owners are engaged in an act of self-flagellation. They love victims and they are it. They wallow in their own self-pity claiming this or that pro-gun group, Northern California liberals, or the Brady Bunch are their downfall. Here it is point blank. There is no one else to blame. 'We have met the enemy and it is us.' Only when gun owners finally take charge of their destiny will all this anti-gun nonsense come to an end. Until then, hope and pray gun owners take action at the polls before they knock on your door demanding your firearms. If California reaches that point, it's too late because most of you cannot be depended on to do anything. You've already proven that.

John Brantuk is going to run again in 2004. For the life of me, I can't imagine why he would waste his time if he can't count on gun owners to get him into office. But John is a driven man with a vision of saving gun rights in California. If you are inclined, there are few people in this state that deserve gun owner's support more than John. Visit his site and donate. Then register to vote online using the link below and start participating in the only process that will make a difference. VOTE!

One final comment. Can you imagine John's shock as he matched up gun show attendees to voter lists and recognized fellow gun owners in the community who "support" him, only to find the people who talk a good game aren't even registered to vote? A lesser person would have thrown in the towel and called it quits. Don't be a big mouth spouting about how no one in California is protecting your rights. It starts with you. If you can't do anything about it, don't expect your neighbors to do something. They probably aren't voting either so it's up to you, the individual gun owner to make a difference.

 

[jblomenberg16]

Two sayings that I've woven into my personal credo:

-Activity without results is meaningless (so, talking the talk means nothing if you don't back it up with results)

-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting different results each time

The second applies to both Anti-gun government and pro-gun civilians. The government needs to realize that gun bans don't work here, don't work in other countries, and at the end of the dame are a result of simple scare tactics used to gain emotional support for other political agendas.

The pro-gun civilians need to realize that our attempts thus far at wrighting letters to our senators, publically voicing our concerns, etc. aren't getting the job done. Other metods are going to need to be developed to protect our freedoms, which may include compromise.

 

[turnandshoot4]

I think the answer to your question, Michiana, is contained within Melensdad's post.

 

[SavageEagle]

The pro-gun civilians need to realize that our attempts thus far at wrighting letters to our senators, publically voicing our concerns, etc. aren't getting the job done. Other metods are going to need to be developed to protect our freedoms, which may include compromise.

I agree and disagree. Letter writing, while a good thing to do, is very ineffective. It accomplishes nothing.

I disagree that we should compromise. But what do YOU mean by compromise? Because compromising one right or restriction for another is counter-productive.

 

[Chefcook]

Two sayings that I've woven into my personal credo:

-Activity without results is meaningless (so, talking the talk means nothing if you don't back it up with results)

-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting different results each time

The second applies to both Anti-gun government and pro-gun civilians. The government needs to realize that gun bans don't work here, don't work in other countries, and at the end of the dame are a result of simple scare tactics used to gain emotional support for other political agendas.

The pro-gun civilians need to realize that our attempts thus far at writing letters to our senators, publicly voicing our concerns, etc. aren't getting the job done. Other methods are going to need to be developed to protect our freedoms, which may include compromise.

There has been far too much compromise as far as our rights are concerned already. NO MORE!!! There comes a time when you just have to say enough is enough and break out the spinach... That time is long overdue. No compromise, no deviation, no excuses. I've stands all I can stands and I cant stands NO MORE... We will have 1984 in 2010...

 

[BloodEclipse]

I would suspect those stats may be typical of California but I seriously doubt that Indiana would look anything like that.

 

[Michiana]

I would suspect those stats may be typical of California but I seriously doubt that Indiana would look anything like that.

I doubt Indiana gun owners are a bad as the stats from California but I would bet we aren't even close to 25% registrated voters. I have found that people who like to talk big and bitch all the time are all bluster and no action.

 

[Michiana]

I think the answer to your question, Michiana, is contained within Melensdad's post.

Which Post?

 

[Ruiner]

I did my job and voted.. Unfortunately, for every one of me, there were 4 liberal idiot college students who voted for Obama at Purdue.

 

[turnandshoot4]

Which Post?

The one about sending letters to oppose Eric Holder.

 

[Michiana]

The vote is what they listen to.

The one about sending letters to oppose Eric Holder.

Sending letters is a good thing only if the politicians believe there are votes behind them. What happened in California can happen anywheres, even Indiana. I came from New York State which has some of the most oppressive gun laws in the country so Indiana is like heaven to me and I don't want to see us go backwards.

My wife and I stood in line almost two hours to vote against Obama this past November but I wonder how many other gun owners drove by their polling places and saw the long lines and kept driving or were not even registered to vote period.

In this day and age every gun owner needs to belong to the NRA, you can join for as little as ten dollars a year if you don't want their mag. The NRA is one of the most powerful lobby's in Washington and the only thing between them and us.

This forum is a great platform for Indiana Gun Owners, yet look at all the outspoken people we have that can't fork up the $11 to be a site supporter but brag how many hundreds of rounds of ammo they shot last weekend. Fenway should not have to be footing the bill for these people to spout off. People need to put their money where their mouths are if we are to at least remain where we are and not slide backwards.

 

[4sarge]

Even in my rural area many anti Obama people did not vote. They staid at home because the media had convinced them that a vote for anyone but Obama was an exercise in futility or that you were a racist if Obama did not win. It is a very sad situation indeed.

 

[amboran]

not all talk

Being a father should bring the responsibility to see that all your kids go and vote also. My youngest(18) could not wait to go vote against the obamanation. Of course he has been brought up around guns-his great grandpa was an avid gun collector and had a shooting match here for many years. He is currently pestering me to sell my Win 1300 defender to himnaw...................

 

[jblomenberg16]

I agree and disagree. Letter writing, while a good thing to do, is very ineffective. It accomplishes nothing.

I disagree that we should compromise. But what do YOU mean by compromise? Because compromising one right or restriction for another is counter-productive.

What I mean by compromise is exactly what the terms means: "a concept of finding agreement through communication. (from wiki)"

That applies to both sides. Our government needs to meanifully consider the interests of gun owners, the letters we're writing to our representaives and senators, etc. We also need to listen and understand the concerns the anti gun crowd has.

I don't mean giving in and abandoning our rights as protected by the 2nd Ammendment. We need to continue to emphasize the necessity to bear arms, for protection, hunting, and sporting purposes. And we need to do so by showing that personal responsibility and good citizenship is and will continue to be a part of that.

IMHO, if that means that I have to go through an FFL check at a gunshow, wait a few days to get a hangun from a dealer, or register my firearms, so be it. I have nothing to hide, and no reason that I would be ashamed that others know that I own particular weapons. To me, it is no different that getting a license to teach school, registering vehicles, or passing a background check to work with children.

I don't think that weapons bans do anything to reduce violent crime. Bad guys still get guns off the street, no matter what. And if anything, a ban will just make the violence associated with getting guns even worse. But I do think that reasonable methods to ensure that guns that are legally purchased are properly documented is a good idea.

So as far as actions go per the original post, we need to conitnue to do all the things we are doing to communicate our ideals, and realize that the more angry and demanding we are, and the more we refuse to compromise, the more the liberal media and government will make us look like extremists. Lets make sure that we don't try so hard to win the battle that we lose the overall war.

 

[SavageEagle]

I voted. I voted thirty times. If you count all the polls and stuff I took online and all the petitions I didn't count... LOL

JB, you fail to realize they aren't talking about JUST gun shows in the "loophole" talk. They are talking about banning private sells. That $1500 rifle you want that is only going to cost you 950? Nope, not if they get their way. FFL and $1300 there buddy. Wait a few days for a Handgun? What about the Domestic Abuse victim who got a restraining order against her soon-to-be Ex? Should she not be able to protect herself that very same day she walks in and out of the gun store? I don't mind that people know what kind of guns I have. But if I own over 20 guns I don't want everyone on God's green Earth to know it! That's like saying "Ok, when I leave, please rob me!"

Nope, No comprimising here.

 

[Archaic_Entity]

What I mean by compromise is exactly what the terms means: "a concept of finding agreement through communication. (from wiki)"

That applies to both sides. Our government needs to meanifully consider the interests of gun owners, the letters we're writing to our representaives and senators, etc. We also need to listen and understand the concerns the anti gun crowd has.

I don't mean giving in and abandoning our rights as protected by the 2nd Ammendment. We need to continue to emphasize the necessity to bear arms, for protection, hunting, and sporting purposes. And we need to do so by showing that personal responsibility and good citizenship is and will continue to be a part of that.

IMHO, if that means that I have to go through an FFL check at a gunshow, wait a few days to get a hangun from a dealer, or register my firearms, so be it. I have nothing to hide, and no reason that I would be ashamed that others know that I own particular weapons. To me, it is no different that getting a license to teach school, registering vehicles, or passing a background check to work with children.

I don't think that weapons bans do anything to reduce violent crime. Bad guys still get guns off the street, no matter what. And if anything, a ban will just make the violence associated with getting guns even worse. But I do think that reasonable methods to ensure that guns that are legally purchased are properly documented is a good idea.

So as far as actions go per the original post, we need to conitnue to do all the things we are doing to communicate our ideals, and realize that the more angry and demanding we are, and the more we refuse to compromise, the more the liberal media and government will make us look like extremists. Lets make sure that we don't try so hard to win the battle that we lose the overall war.

The issue I think you're going to run into with a lot of people on this forum is that a lot of them disagree with registering weapons--and with good reason.

The first step in outlawing guns is making sure you know who has all the legal ones. That's one of the great things about IN. Here, we don't have to register for anything. Here, you don't know what I own, you don't know what I carry, you only suspect that I am. In other places, where they know what you have, they can use that information against you. If it becomes a national law to register all of your firearms, the next step is to take them all away. They know what you're holding, and they won't stop searching until they get it--if they truly get so determined.

I would disagree with a national register for that reason. Waiting for your record to be run through? That's fine. Rather safe than sorry, but to the same argument, what stops them from logging that? They know you're shopping.

The government should not regulate the purchase or owning of firearms, except to people who are felons. It's the same thing with child molesters. The government should not tell me where to live, I've done nothing that gives them the right to take one of mine away. But for a child molester? They shouldn't get the privilege (if you call it that) to live next to an elementary school. Personally, I would hate to live next to one.

If you want to find an agreement through discussion, then there are two things that should happen. One, the media and those in command should be open to discuss. As a lot of people have proven on here, they're willing to discuss their heads off. And two, the people that are adamant for their rights to be protected must make an effort to protect their rights. Be it by voting, running for some form of office, or doing what they can to further the cause.

Personally, I voted. And I will continue to vote. The system is futile, at least when it comes to the Presidential election. The electoral college needs to be done away with. But, as it's been said, if you didn't vote, you can't bitch.

 

[jblomenberg16]

The issue I think you're going to run into with a lot of people on this forum is that a lot of them disagree with registering weapons--and with good reason.

The first step in outlawing guns is making sure you know who has all the legal ones. That's one of the great things about IN. Here, we don't have to register for anything. Here, you don't know what I own, you don't know what I carry, you only suspect that I am. In other places, where they know what you have, they can use that information against you. If it becomes a national law to register all of your firearms, the next step is to take them all away. They know what you're holding, and they won't stop searching until they get it--if they truly get so determined.

I would disagree with a national register for that reason. Waiting for your record to be run through? That's fine. Rather safe than sorry, but to the same argument, what stops them from logging that? They know you're shopping.

The government should not regulate the purchase or owning of firearms, except to people who are felons. It's the same thing with child molesters. The government should not tell me where to live, I've done nothing that gives them the right to take one of mine away. But for a child molester? They shouldn't get the privilege (if you call it that) to live next to an elementary school. Personally, I would hate to live next to one.

If you want to find an agreement through discussion, then there are two things that should happen. One, the media and those in command should be open to discuss. As a lot of people have proven on here, they're willing to discuss their heads off. And two, the people that are adamant for their rights to be protected must make an effort to protect their rights. Be it by voting, running for some form of office, or doing what they can to further the cause.

Personally, I voted. And I will continue to vote. The system is futile, at least when it comes to the Presidential election. The electoral college needs to be done away with. But, as it's been said, if you didn't vote, you can't bitch.

Exactly. And guys, please don't misunderstand me...I love the no registering, same day purchase, private sales, and other freedoms that we have here in Indiana, and don't want to change them. What I'm trying to say is that if it comes down to no guns, or having a few more rules to follow, I'm in the camp of following a few more rules in order to keep my guns.

Very fair points about a registry beng one step closer into being able to do a nation wide gun grab and the waiting period. But that's where we have to step up the heat and prove that taking guns away isn't going to fix the the problem. The people that legally have them are the small minority of those that are using them to committ violent crimes with them.

So yes, vote, run for public office, write letters, do whatever needs to be done to show that we're not going to just give in. But also don't sink to the level of the other camp here by just refusing on principle.

I'll stop now since I've sorta hijacked this thread.

 

[jsgolfman]

This may sound trite, but it analogous to the frog in the boiling water.

 

[HICKMAN]

Almost half of this country doesn't vote, we are pathetic when it comes to actually getting out and making a difference.

My own brother, who was all anti-Obama... wasn't even registered. I was checking online to make sure my wife and I were good to go, and started plugging in our other family members. Sure enough, he was all air and no vote.

WE have to get people with opinions like ours registered and voting, then get them involved in doing the same, else we are living in a dying republic.

 

[SavageEagle]

This may sound trite, but it analogous to the frog in the boiling water.

HUH????

Almost half of this country doesn't vote, we are pathetic when it comes to actually getting out and making a difference.

<snip>

WE have to get people with opinions like ours registered and voting, then get them involved in doing the same, else we are living in a dying republic.

2/3's of this Country doesn't vote. That's a big difference. Imagine if all 80+million gun owners stood up and voted....

Getting people motivated to vote is the hardest thing in the world to do. Hell, getting people to write letters or get off their butt to go to any meetings is hard enough!

I voted. I can bitch. We can all do other things too.