Why Indiana's Law Is Better Than Pennsylvania's

[JoshuaW]

I'm guessing he Nolo'd and took a plea agreement. Rather than fight the charges (sometimes it's cheaper). He says he was charged and served probation not that he was found guilty by a jury or judge. If he was carrying it in unloaded and in a secure wrapper he would be okay. Definition of secure wrapper?. I would say it means locked (secured) and contained within, otherwise it would simply say out of plain view.

BTW it's only case law if the person was convicted by a jury of it and appealed. Only a judge can set precedent.

so yes he could have fought it.

the law doesn't state that he must own the business, just that it is his place of business, ie he does business there and that it be at a fixed location. How do you think people can do shooting competitions in this state? Do you think everyone who does competition shootings has an LTCH?

A good lawyer would get you off. It all depends how much money you are willing to spend. Whether you get arrested or chaged that is always up to the officer and prosecuters.

Sadly until somebody gets arrested, fights it, appeals it if convicted this arguement will never end.

IANAL

Doesnt change the fact that since there is no definitive answer, you would still be open for the charges. The best bet is to keep ignorant of the law (so as to not deliberately break it) and not waive your rights. The thread that was linked had one major issue: He had it INSIDE the passenger area. To me, that is not secure. But, whatever. The biggest point here is to just get an LTCH.

Oh, and for what it is worth, I am sure majority of competitive shooters have their LTCH.

 

[trnsplntfrmohio]

uhhh... what other states are you required to notify? obviously in IN, if the LEO asks you directly, you have to answer, but what states require you to announce?

I wouldn't do it, just lie. If they do find out you are carrying a HANDGUN you must present yar LTCH

Anything else they want to know/find/look through they can get a search warrant, sometimes I've got all the time in the world.

Back in Ohio on a Friday night, I had mistakenly ran a red light (so they say). I was leaving the ford dealer after having a warranty repair done, very unfamiliar with the area as I had just started a job up there. Well I get pulled over, the cop being a huge dick power tripper asked me if I had anything I shouldn't in the car. I was 21 at the time, yet even to this day I look like I'm 16/17 at times, I had a 6 pack of beer in the back seat and the cop saw it. I showed my ID proved I was of age to have the beer in the car, then he asked if I minded if he took I look I said, sir you may look all you want if you get a search warrant.

Then came the power trip: YOU PUNK THESE ARE MY STREETS YOU'RE GOING TO DO WHAT I SAY.

I said, sir as long as you have a search warrant, you're good to go through my stuff

Well being Friday night around 8:30 he's obviously not getting a search warrant, and because I had only commited a minor traffic offense he was not taking me to jail. And I had all the time in the world, as I was not going out until about 11:30 with my friends.

He asked me to step out of the car, so I got out and locked my doors. He started to frisk me and I told him hey, get your hands off me I'm not under arrest and If I was I wanted a lawyer right now.

Well then he said he would go back to his car and call is boss and find out how to go through my car.

Well he went back to his car, I still standing outside called up the county mounties, (not really county mounties as hey do not ride horses yet drive Crown Vic's and told them what was going on, and guess what 3 minutes later a Lake County Sheriff (ohio) car pulls between me and the city copper. Well the city cop is pissed gets out of his car and starts screaming, then the Sheriff starts talking to him about how he cannot detain me without probable cause, can't go through my stuff without a search warrant. I ended up leaving, filing a formal complaint with the city about the incident, I even went to the point of filing a charge for the 2 hours I was illegally detained.

The next time I went through that city I was followed by 2 of the city cops all the way until I left the city limits, and then again on my return trip, when I sat next to one at a traffic light on the city limits, the copper put his window down and told me not to come through here anymore or I would find serious trouble for myself. I sat there pretending not to hear him, until the light turned green. I looked over and said

"FU, you piece of copper tax payer money wasting pig" and gave him the double bird.

I think he was just stunned beyond all belief because he sat there for about 30 seconds hands on the wheel not moving with people honking their horns.

Needless to say the rest of my time I spent in ohio I avoided Willoughby like the plague.

 

[JoshuaW]

I wouldn't do it, just lie. If they do find out you are carrying a HANDGUN you must present yar LTCH

Anything else they want to know/find/look through they can get a search warrant, sometimes I've got all the time in the world.

Back in Ohio on a Friday night, I had mistakenly ran a red light (so they say). I was leaving the ford dealer after having a warranty repair done, very unfamiliar with the area as I had just started a job up there. Well I get pulled over, the cop being a huge dick power tripper asked me if I had anything I shouldn't in the car. I was 21 at the time, yet even to this day I look like I'm 16/17 at times, I had a 6 pack of beer in the back seat and the cop saw it. I showed my ID proved I was of age to have the beer in the car, then he asked if I minded if he took I look I said, sir you may look all you want if you get a search warrant.

Then came the power trip: YOU PUNK THESE ARE MY STREETS YOU'RE GOING TO DO WHAT I SAY.

I said, sir as long as you have a search warrant, you're good to go through my stuff

Well being Friday night around 8:30 he's obviously not getting a search warrant, and because I had only commited a minor traffic offense he was not taking me to jail. And I had all the time in the world, as I was not going out until about 11:30 with my friends.

He asked me to step out of the car, so I got out and locked my doors. He started to frisk me and I told him hey, get your hands off me I'm not under arrest and If I was I wanted a lawyer right now.

Well then he said he would go back to his car and call is boss and find out how to go through my car.

Well he went back to his car, I still standing outside called up the county mounties, (not really county mounties as hey do not ride horses yet drive Crown Vic's and told them what was going on, and guess what 3 minutes later a Lake County Sheriff (ohio) car pulls between me and the city copper. Well the city cop is pissed gets out of his car and starts screaming, then the Sheriff starts talking to him about how he cannot detain me without probable cause, can't go through my stuff without a search warrant. I ended up leaving, filing a formal complaint with the city about the incident, I even went to the point of filing a charge for the 2 hours I was illegally detained.

The next time I went through that city I was followed by 2 of the city cops all the way until I left the city limits, and then again on my return trip, when I sat next to one at a traffic light on the city limits, the copper put his window down and told me not to come through here anymore or I would find serious trouble for myself. I sat there pretending not to hear him, until the light turned green. I looked over and said

"FU, you piece of copper tax payer money wasting pig" and gave him the double bird.

I think he was just stunned beyond all belief because he sat there for about 30 seconds hands on the wheel not moving with people honking their horns.

Needless to say the rest of my time I spent in ohio I avoided Willoughby like the plague.

If you had filed a harassment complaint, they would leave you alone pretty quickly.

 

[Bill of Rights]

I'm guessing he Nolo'd and took a plea agreement. Rather than fight the charges (sometimes it's cheaper). He says he was charged and served probation not that he was found guilty by a jury or judge. If he was carrying it in unloaded and in a secure wrapper he would be okay. Definition of secure wrapper?. I would say it means locked (secured) and contained within, otherwise it would simply say out of plain view.

BTW it's only case law if the person was convicted by a jury of it and appealed. Only a judge can set precedent.

so yes he could have fought it.

the law doesn't state that he must own the business, just that it is his place of business, ie he does business there and that it be at a fixed location. How do you think people can do shooting competitions in this state? Do you think everyone who does competition shootings has an LTCH?

A good lawyer would get you off. It all depends how much money you are willing to spend. Whether you get arrested or chaged that is always up to the officer and prosecuters.

Sadly until somebody gets arrested, fights it, appeals it if convicted this arguement will never end.

IANAL

Yes, I'm quite certain you're right and everyone else is wrong. You can carry anywhere you want to, no license required ever, and when you get arrested and taken before a judge for doing so, you just tell them that someone on the internet agreed with your interpretation and told you it was OK to do so.

I'm all out of purple ink, but hopefully, anyone reading this will see the sarcasm dripping from it.

The law is clear. If you refuse to accept the text of it, we're sure not going to convince you. That job will have to fall to your arresting officers, your judge, and depending on the sentence, your cellmates.

Edit: If you want to be the test case and get binding precedent set that will prevent prosecutors and judges from charging and/or convicting peaceable citizens (of Indiana) of carrying without a LTCH (or similar government-issued permission slip (for peaceable citizens living outside of Indiana)), you go challenge it. Send me the IN Supreme Court ruling affirming the above and once I confirm it as being that binding precedent, if it is legal for me to do so, I will send you a gift card for a steak dinner ("Where" will be decided later; I don't know where you are nor what places are close to you, but I'm not talking about Steak and Shake's steakburgers.)

Good luck, you're gonna need it.

Bill