Why Indiana's Law Is Better Than Pennsylvania's

[mrjarrell]

In Indiana we are not required to notify an enforcer if we are armed when stopped. In Pennsylvania you ARE required to notify. Too bad, too. It can have severe consequences when you have to notify them. Sometimes they'll do more than steal your gun and fondle it.

via Post-Gazette

Two police officers already facing a federal lawsuit for shooting and killing a man during St. Patrick's Day festivities on the South Side have been named again in a separate incident.
Pennsylvania State Police Trooper Samuel Nassan and Pittsburgh police Sgt. Terrence Donnelly are accused of battery and civil rights violations stemming from an incident July 6, 2008.
David Palmer said he was pulled over in the 1000 block of East Carson Street early that morning. When Trooper Nassan approached the driver's side, Mr. Palmer said he told the officer he had a permit to carry a concealed firearm and a gun in his pocket.
"Nassan, without reason and without provocation, violently struck plaintiff in the head, neck and face," the lawsuit said.
The complaint goes on to say Trooper Nassan and Sgt. Donnelly, as well as Pittsburgh Officer Sheila Ladner then forced Mr. Palmer to the ground, repeatedly striking him and then shooting him with a Taser in his chest.
The lawsuit also names as defendants the Pennsylvania State Police and city of Pittsburgh.

Read the rest at the source. And keep your own business to yourself.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Sometimes they'll do more than steal your gun and fondle it.

Yes, I know, they point it back at you.

 

[cosermann]

Required to notify in Michigan also.

 

[henktermaat]

Indiana is a great state, I don't care what the complainers say.

 

[tskin]

Indiana is a great state, I don't care what the complainers say.

Dang right, I tell people all the time "Indiana has great gun laws."

 

[96firephoenix]

uhhh... what other states are you required to notify? obviously in IN, if the LEO asks you directly, you have to answer, but what states require you to announce?

 

[rockhopper46038]

I'd say that Mr. Palmer is likely to own the entire state of Pennsylvania upon conclusion of this trial...

... but who the *&%! would want it?

 

[45calibre]

talk about a pair of power trippers

 

[henktermaat]

NC is a must notify state as well.

 

[Turn Key]

uhhh... what other states are you required to notify? obviously in IN, if the LEO asks you directly, you have to answer, but what states require you to announce?

When asked politely state, "I have nothing illegal in my vehicle sir."


TK

 

[Joe Williams]

But in PA you can OC without a license, and also take your gun to the range without a license.

Sure be nice to get at least that latter put into law here, since so many cops tell folks they can do it anyway. Be a shame for a citizen to think they are within the bounds of the law for doing what a well meaning cop told them they could do, then run into some dude/dudette who just had a fight with their wife and is looking to hook someone up, or Officer Gungho who is three days out of the academy and thinks busts for spitting on the sidewalk really do help fight crime!

 

[Delmar]

But in PA you can OC without a license, and also take your gun to the range without a license.

Sure be nice to get at least that latter put into law here, since so many cops tell folks they can do it anyway. Be a shame for a citizen to think they are within the bounds of the law for doing what a well meaning cop told them they could do, then run into some dude/dudette who just had a fight with their wife and is looking to hook someone up, or Officer Gungho who is three days out of the academy and thinks busts for spitting on the sidewalk really do help fight crime!

We need to lobby, and lobby hard so that people can transport a handgun in their car without a license. If we got that passed, I would a lot more pleased with Indiana's gun laws.

 

[SedahDrol]

Gotta love Indiana. The only answer you have to give a police officer is who you are (I still say that even that violates your right from self incrimination). To think when I was younger, I desperately wanted to move out of this state.

But in PA you can OC without a license, and also take your gun to the range without a license.

Sure be nice to get at least that latter put into law here, since so many cops tell folks they can do it anyway. Be a shame for a citizen to think they are within the bounds of the law for doing what a well meaning cop told them they could do, then run into some dude/dudette who just had a fight with their wife and is looking to hook someone up, or Officer Gungho who is three days out of the academy and thinks busts for spitting on the sidewalk really do help fight crime!

FYI you are allowed to take your gun to the range in indiana without an ltch:
IC 35-47-2-2

(11) any person while carrying a handgun unloaded and in a secure wrapper from the place of purchase to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or to a place of repair or back to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or in moving from one dwelling or business to another.

you can take it from the store to your home or a fixed place of business (firing range).
to a place of repair
back to your dwelling unit
or fixed place of business (firing range)

 

[downzero]

Gotta love Indiana. The only answer you have to give a police officer is who you are (I still say that even that violates your right from self incrimination). To think when I was younger, I desperately wanted to move out of this state.



FYI you are allowed to take your gun to the range in indiana without an ltch:
IC 35-47-2-2

(11) any person while carrying a handgun unloaded and in a secure wrapper from the place of purchase to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or to a place of repair or back to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or in moving from one dwelling or business to another.

you can take it from the store to your home or a fixed place of business (firing range).
to a place of repair
back to your dwelling unit
or fixed place of business (firing range)

Key word: his.

Unless you own the firing range, that is illegal.

 

[zebov]

Gotta love Indiana. The only answer you have to give a police officer is who you are (I still say that even that violates your right from self incrimination). To think when I was younger, I desperately wanted to move out of this state.



FYI you are allowed to take your gun to the range in indiana without an ltch:
IC 35-47-2-2

(11) any person while carrying a handgun unloaded and in a secure wrapper from the place of purchase to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or to a place of repair or back to his dwelling or fixed place of business, or in moving from one dwelling or business to another.

you can take it from the store to your home or a fixed place of business (firing range).
to a place of repair
back to your dwelling unit
or fixed place of business (firing range)

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. This is the wrong interpretation of this law. Want proof? https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._self_defense/25254-asking_for_your_help.html

 

[Delmar]

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. This is the wrong interpretation of this law. Want proof? https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._self_defense/25254-asking_for_your_help.html

The really sad part about this story is, if this young man had not thought he was legal and never volunteered the info that he had a gun in the car, he never would have been charged. He got no credit what so ever, for trying to be open and honest and trying to obey the law, as it was explained to him by another cop.

 

[Delmar]

Key word: his.

Unless you own the firing range, that is illegal.

If the gun-store actually has a gunsmith on duty there might be some wiggle room in the law. Problem is you might well be getting yourself into a guilty until proven innocent situation, if you tried that one.

 

[jsgolfman]

When asked politely state, "I have nothing illegal in my vehicle sir."


TK

^This.
Also, how the hell are those two still on the force?

 

[JoshuaW]

If the gun-store actually has a gunsmith on duty there might be some wiggle room in the law. Problem is you might well be getting yourself into a guilty until proven innocent situation, if you tried that one.

Ah, but if you exercise your rights, it should not be an issue. If pulled over and asked if you have any guns in your car, you can simply state "Nope, I dont have any guns in here with me" or something along the lines of that. Proceed as normal. If for some reason the cop wants to take a look, simply dont let them. The most obvious thing is to keep it locked in the trunk during transport as well.

**Transporting a handgun without a license is illegal. Do not do so. Seriously, dont.**

 

[SedahDrol]

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. This is the wrong interpretation of this law. Want proof? https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._self_defense/25254-asking_for_your_help.html

I'm guessing he Nolo'd and took a plea agreement. Rather than fight the charges (sometimes it's cheaper). He says he was charged and served probation not that he was found guilty by a jury or judge. If he was carrying it in unloaded and in a secure wrapper he would be okay. Definition of secure wrapper?. I would say it means locked (secured) and contained within, otherwise it would simply say out of plain view.

BTW it's only case law if the person was convicted by a jury of it and appealed. Only a judge can set precedent.

so yes he could have fought it.

the law doesn't state that he must own the business, just that it is his place of business, ie he does business there and that it be at a fixed location. How do you think people can do shooting competitions in this state? Do you think everyone who does competition shootings has an LTCH?

A good lawyer would get you off. It all depends how much money you are willing to spend. Whether you get arrested or chaged that is always up to the officer and prosecuters.

Sadly until somebody gets arrested, fights it, appeals it if convicted this arguement will never end.

IANAL