Romeo 1 Optic On Sig 320c

[Gunaddict]

Because my vision is not what it used to be, I started purchasing firearms with optic ready slides. I traded for a Sig 320 compact with a Romeo 1 optic and I honestly think the optic sucks. Sig is very proud of that optic, but I feel like there is way too much margin of error with the small MOA and large reticle….and it does not co-witness even with suppressor height sights. I have a Canik with a much smaller reticle and I have much better accuracy with it. I feel like I am all over with Sig and Romeo. Anyone have a better suggestion for optic on a 320C that will co-witness?

 

[Route 45]

If your vision is bad to the point that you need an optic instead of iron sights, why are you worried about co-witness?

 

[WebSnyper]

When you say cowitness are you saying you can't see the sights through the optic at all?

What size is the dot on that optic?

Could try a Delta Point Pro if you are into small dot, not enclosed, as I believe the 320's are cut with that footprint.


I believe the Holosun SCS 320 also fits https://holosun.com/products/reflex-sight/scs/scs-320.html

Enclosed and fits the DPP footprint.

Some newer 320's also have RMR screw holes but I believe you may still need a plate (but research that as I haven't fully checked that out)

 

[92FSTech]

I have some quibbles with the Romeo 1, but none of them are the reasons you mentioned.

I'm not sure what you mean by "small MOA and large reticle". Is yours a 3 moa or 6 moa dot? Either way, neither is a particularly large dot, and either is more than acceptable for combat accuracy with a handgun.

As to co-witness, you should be able to line your irons up and have the dot settle right on the tip of the front sight post. If it's not doing that, you need to adjust your zero. My Romeo1 on my P320 with supressor-height sights co-witnesses just fine. That said, when shooting I'm only paying attention to the dot and not looking at the irons at all. The low-parallax nature of the optic allows you to utilize the dot completely independently of the irons.

 

[WebSnyper]

I have some quibbles with the Romeo 1, but none of them are the reasons you mentioned.

I'm not sure what you mean by "small MOA and large reticle". Is yours a 3 moa or 6 moa dot? Either way, neither is a particularly large dot, and either is more than acceptable for combat accuracy with a handgun.

As to co-witness, you should be able to line your irons up and have the dot settle right on the tip of the front sight post. If it's not doing that, you need to adjust your zero. My Romeo1 on my P320 with supressor-height sights co-witnesses just fine. That said, when shooting I'm only paying attention to the dot and not looking at the irons at all. The low-parallax nature of the optic allows you to utilize the dot completely independently of the irons.

Slaving the dot to the iron sights is not the way according to everything I've seen on the subject for handguns.

 

[STFU]

My first question is: what is the purpose of the weapon? Is this your EDC? A competition piece? Or something else altogether?

Next, if you are trying to compete with it:

• Forget the co-witness bit. Rarely serves a purpose in competition unless your battery dies.
• Get the 6 MOA version and turn it up. Easier to find the dot and harder to miss with the 6 MOA version of the Romeo 1.

Lastly, if it is an EDC piece, you might want to change to a Holosun or other optic that has a nice big (~32MOA) ring.
Whatever makes your eyes happy. But again, co-witnessing is worthless. If you are in a SHTF situation, you will not be checking for co-witness as you close on center of mass at close range...

Just my thoughts. YMMV.

 

[gassprint1]

Having read the first post had me confused. You get a red dot because of eye sight, but are trying to line up the dot with sights. Either your eyes aren't as bad as you think or you are lost on what the purpose a red dot serves. That red dot alone is your sight. What ever distance it's sighted for, put that dot on it and pull trigger. If you can't see the dot, turn the brightness up. If having issues in bright daylight seeing the red, find an optical that has a green dot because it will be easier to see over red..or find an optical that has both red and green. At our last nwi meet an shoot, i shot another member's sig i think that had a green crosshair option sight dot. I liked it alot better than the red. I think it was a halosun. Maybe @repeter1977 will chime in with the info on what I'm referring to.

 

[LokhXIV]

I'll throw in a vote for the SCS 320 as well. I put one on my echelon and love it. There's likely gonna be at least one dealer with a sale coming up too since the 4th is in a couple weeks. If you keep your eye out, a lot of dealers with an online presence will have you contact them via email or text to get a link for a deal below MAP.

As far as slaving the dot goes, it usually gets me pretty close when I'm zeroing it for the first time. The SCS ended up being pretty damned close and only need a couple clicks of adjustment after that. I'd agree though that it shouldn't be your end goal.

 

[92FSTech]

Slaving the dot to the iron sights is not the way according to everything I've seen on the subject for handguns.

If your irons and the optic are both properly zeroed to the same point of impact, when you visually align the irons the dot is going to be in alignment with the irons as well. It has to be.

However, because the optic has very minimal parallax, you can make hits simply by visually placing the dot anywhere in the window between your eye and the target, without taking the time to visually align the sights.

I have had a Romeo1 shift zero without warning twice in the past. When this happened, I caught it right away because my morning routine is to check alignment of the dot to the irons, and in both cases the dot was way off. I took it to the range and confirmed this before re-zeroing. But it's important (especially because the optic clearly doesn't hold zero with 100% reliability) to have a visual method of confirming a rough zero without having to actually go shoot the gun.

To illustrate my point:

In this picture, the target, irons, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are all "perfectly" aligned. You can see how the dot is set to provide the same point of impact as the irons.



In this second photo, the target, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are aligned, but the irons are not. You see that the dot is no longer located in the same area of the window, however the "parallax-free" nature of the dot will allow for hits at the same (or very, very close) point of impact, even though I haven't taken the time to visually align the irons. The gun is still pointed at the same point of impact on the target, it's just not perfectly aligned with my eye (camera).

 

[WebSnyper]

If your irons and the optic are both properly zeroed to the same point of impact, when you visually align the irons the dot is going to be in alignment with the irons as well. It has to be.

However, because the optic has very minimal parallax, you can make hits simply by visually placing the dot anywhere in the window between your eye and the target, without taking the time to visually align the sights.

I have had a Romeo1 shift zero without warning twice in the past. When this happened, I caught it right away because my morning routine is to check alignment of the dot to the irons, and in both cases the dot was way off. I took it to the range and confirmed this before re-zeroing. But it's important (especially because the optic clearly doesn't hold zero with 100% reliability) to have a visual method of confirming a rough zero without having to actually go shoot the gun.

To illustrate my point:

In this picture, the target, irons, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are all "perfectly" aligned. You can see how the dot is set to provide the same point of impact as the irons.

View attachment 360427

In this second photo, the target, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are aligned, but the irons are not. You see that the dot is no longer located in the same area of the window, however the "parallax-free" nature of the dot will allow for hits at the same (or very, very close) point of impact, even though I haven't taken the time to visually align the irons. The gun is still pointed at the same point of impact on the target, it's just not perfectly aligned with my eye (camera).

View attachment 360428

 

[92FSTech]

Point of clarification...I don't zero my red dot by slaving to the irons. I zero at 15 yards independently of the irons. I shoot and make adjustments to the dot until my point of aim aligns with my point of impact. But when I align the irons with my eye, that yields the sight picture that you see in the first photo above. I didn't intentionally put it there, that's just where it ends up when the optic is properly zeroed at 15 yards. If I was using a 25 yard zero like Aaron is in the video, the dot would likely appear slightly higher in the window and above the front sight post.

The only time I am consciously "slaving" the dot to the irons is to rough-confirm the zero to make sure it hasn't shifted. If I line everything up and it's off (like it has been a coupe of time in the past), I now have a point of reference that tells me something has moved and I need to check that all the fasteners are secure and go re-zero.

 

[DRob]

I've got Romeos on two P320s and have no issues. When using a red (or green) dot, I have both eyes open focused on the target rather than on the dot. The iron sights aren't even in the game. Works just fine for me. There's a learning curve but once you get it, it's great for old eyes.

 

[Gunaddict]

My first question is: what is the purpose of the weapon? Is this your EDC? A competition piece? Or something else altogether?

Next, if you are trying to compete with it:

• Forget the co-witness bit. Rarely serves a purpose in competition unless your battery dies.
• Get the 6 MOA version and turn it up. Easier to find the dot and harder to miss with the 6 MOA version of the Romeo 1.

Lastly, if it is an EDC piece, you might want to change to a Holosun or other optic that has a nice big (~32MOA) ring.
Whatever makes your eyes happy. But again, co-witnessing is worthless. If you are in a SHTF situation, you will not be checking for co-witness as you close on center of mass at close range...

Just my thoughts. YMMV.

With the larger reticle (window) and the 2 MOA dot, if it isn’t exactly centered in the window then you aren’t hitting centered on the target. I am using it for a league and when you are rapid firing that dot can be off a tick in the big window to go off target because there is no reference to center. There was another suggestion of the Holosun SCS with the 32 MOA ring and 2 MOA dot in the center that I just ordered.

 

[Gunaddict]

If your irons and the optic are both properly zeroed to the same point of impact, when you visually align the irons the dot is going to be in alignment with the irons as well. It has to be.

However, because the optic has very minimal parallax, you can make hits simply by visually placing the dot anywhere in the window between your eye and the target, without taking the time to visually align the sights.

I have had a Romeo1 shift zero without warning twice in the past. When this happened, I caught it right away because my morning routine is to check alignment of the dot to the irons, and in both cases the dot was way off. I took it to the range and confirmed this before re-zeroing. But it's important (especially because the optic clearly doesn't hold zero with 100% reliability) to have a visual method of confirming a rough zero without having to actually go shoot the gun.

To illustrate my point:

In this picture, the target, irons, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are all "perfectly" aligned. You can see how the dot is set to provide the same point of impact as the irons.

View attachment 360427

In this second photo, the target, optic, and shooter's eye (camera) are aligned, but the irons are not. You see that the dot is no longer located in the same area of the window, however the "parallax-free" nature of the dot will allow for hits at the same (or very, very close) point of impact, even though I haven't taken the time to visually align the irons. The gun is still pointed at the same point of impact on the target, it's just not perfectly aligned with my eye (camera).

View attachment 360428

I am shooting anywhere from 15-75 feet and if the dot isn’t centered, it makes a difference down range. I have not checked to see if the dot has drifted which may be a lot of my issue. That is the only reason I want to co-witness because it will be obvious if the dot drifts.