Plaxico: Jail or No?

[kludge]

Holy thread necromancy, Batman!

Now I'm going to get another slew of negative reps for using the term "negro" to remind everyone of the post-civil war origins of our draconian big city gun laws aimed soley at "keeping the black man down."

Would it have been a good Supreme Court case? Who knows. We'll never know - someone has to be willing to go to jail. Honest people can't bring a case without getting it thrown out for "standing" and our legal precident based on decisions made because there really are some people that we really don't want running around in public, and they ruin it for the rest of us.

Plaxico was a victim of his own stupidity and/or machismo, that is certain, but no one in this country deserves to serve two years for exercising a constitutional right.

 

[XMil]

Well, I just gave you a positive to offset one negative. And for using the word "necromancy" in a sentence.

 

[kludge]

The only thing he's been found guilty of is impersonating a free citizen.

+1 and reps.

 

[kludge]

I'm getting the impression that some members do not know the gun laws of New York. NY does NOT accept any other state permits... there is absolutely NO reciprical agreement...ZERO. Burress's Florida permit may as well have been from Jupiter.
And I have expressed this many times here, every New Yorker knows that you cannot carry in a place that serves alcohol...period.

I am Not in favor of NY's decision or its laws. I left there 5 years ago partly because of them and other conditions.

If Burress got off, NY would have had to release thousands of other "Felons".

Yes, I am aware of this. And yes, if the only thing these "felons" are in jail for is possession of a handgun, then they should go free.

In fact, if there is anyone in a DC jail that is serving time now that Heller has been decided they should be let out too, and their records exponged, and reparations (court costs, lost wages, pain and suffering, etc.) paid to those who spent time in jail before Heller.

It's only right.

 

[Dryden]

Yes, I am aware of this. And yes, if the only thing these "felons" are in jail for is possession of a handgun, then they should go free.

In fact, if there is anyone in a DC jail that is serving time now that Heller has been decided they should be let out too, and their records exponged, and reparations (court costs, lost wages, pain and suffering, etc.) paid to those who spent time in jail before Heller.

It's only right.

I am not disagreeing. But, with NY's politicans, it will not happen in our lifetime.

 

[Griffeycom]

It's a shame the poll wasn't written with viable choices. While I don't agree with the NYC law...if it were me...I'd be in jail.

If you want it changed...then fight to change it. Until then...off to prison with him.

Bye, bye.

These are my thoughts as well. There are plenty of laws that I don't agree with and that I believe are stupid. But laws are laws and if you break them, stupid or not, you must face the consequences. If you want them changed fight to get them changed!

 

[public servant]

These are my thoughts as well. There are plenty of laws that I don't agree with and that I believe are stupid. But laws are laws and if you break them, stupid or not, you must face the consequences. If you want them changed fight to get them changed!

Personal responsibility.

 

[22lr]

As unjust as the law is, it is still the law. Damage to his career aside he broke the law and has to pay for it. Its not like he didnt have the money to start a legal fight over the law, and he should have been smart enough to not pack a gun into a bar.

 

[Cygnus]

Obviously the sarcasm of the original choices was missed back before this thread was reurected. The law does restrict New Yorkers 2nd ammendment rights and by implication the first right mentioned in the preamble. However, while it's on the books it is still the law of the land. Plax had the money to satrt a legal battle. it would have been interesting to see if the NRA or GOA would have taken up the fight for him. May have been a good way for bringing people into the pro2nd ammendment groups that have historicly been underrepresented there.
Maybe an empty holster '"FREE PLAX!" march should be organized by New Yorkers.

Now all that being said. He's rich, he has lawyers, he has security people.....dumb individual move, dumb law.!

He's lucky he didn't shoot little Plax off as welll!

 

[Benjamin]

I don't approve of the wording of this poll. Race should not be an issue.

 

[VERT]

The only thing plaxico is guilty of is being an idiot for shooting himself and not using a proper holster. In both cases there is no victim other than himself and even in todays sue happy world you cannot sue yourself.

Plaxico is being charged with a victimless crime. Period. Show me a victim and we can talk about that.

Victimless crime yes, but unfortunately he was guilty of volating the law in that state. Not that I agree with NY gun laws. Now the comment about holsters is absolutely correct. When I first heard this story I was having lunch at the local pizza buffet and imediately thought to myself: "A guy makes millions of dollars a year and he couldn't buy a decent holster."

 

[Cygnus]

I don't approve of the wording of this poll. Race should not be an issue.

Benjamin,

I originally thought the same thing but then thought about it. There is only one reasonable choice in the poll. The other choice is sarcasm to make the other more obvious. The OP, kludge , has stated in a post just a few above ours that he did that to draw atttention tot he fact that inner city gun restrictions have historically impacted good, law abiding minorities in a negative way.
(I.e. If they own guns they are "criminals" if they don't they are more open to being victims of criminals.) When enacted they were racially motivated to a large degree. That is why the OP used the terminology of the day, to draw attention to that fact.....correct me if I'm wrong kludge....

 

[GuyRelford]

Let's review. He took a gun into a night club - with no license to carry - without a holster, tucked into the waistband of his pants. As he was walking up some stairs, his unsecured pistol started falling down his pant leg, so he reached down to "catch" it and inadvertently pulled the trigger and shot himself. He was then charged with illegal possession of a handgun.

I don't care how ridiculous NY's gun laws are - can anyone seriously condone this behavior? He was completely irresponsible and any legitimate gun owner should be offended by his conduct.

 

[dburkhead]

Civil Disobedience as a tool toward getting laws changed is a viable option but somehow I don't think Plaxico had that in mind. If he did, "Mexican Carry" in a bar in New York as a single individual rather than as a part of a larger group is almost a textbook example of how not to do it.

Civil Disobedience works when the enforcement of the law is so contrary to public values that enforcing it leads to public outrage. That could be shown from the start if you have a large number of people disobeying the law they believe should be changed, or it can come later as a result of said enforcement--somebody who everyone agrees is a "good guy" who doesn't "deserve" the results of that enforcment and so many come to realize that the law is unjust because of what is done to said "good guy."

None of that applies to this case however.

 

[gglass]

I still have a hard time getting my mind around the notion that you can be imprisoned for exercising a right that was bestowed upon you at birth. A right that is spelled out in perfectly simple language, in the bill of rights, that states that "the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed".

If Burris was charged with something like unlawful discharge of a firearm and given a two year sentence, I would be fine with that outcome. It is the use of the already unconstitutional "unlawful possession" law that makes me want to jump out of my skin. A law that would apply to any otherwise legal gun owner in New York City

It just makes my head spin.

 

[XMil]

Would any of you in the "he got what he deserved because he broke the law" crowd feel the same way if he was going to prison for practicing Christianity?

 

[kludge]

These are my thoughts as well. There are plenty of laws that I don't agree with and that I believe are stupid. But laws are laws and if you break them, stupid or not, you must face the consequences. If you want them changed fight to get them changed!

How do you propose to fight them?

Introduce new legislation? It will get tabled by the democratic leadership.

Sue for your rights in court? The federal circuit court has already ruled on this, and your right no longer exists. And that's if the case isn't thrown out for lack of "standing."

How do you get standing? You have to break the law and risk jail. "Risk" is used tongue in cheek. Jail is a foregone conclusion.

Unfortunately "It's not time yet" is the only thing we have. Maybe after SCOTUS rules on the Chicago case there will be a chance. Until then there is nothing.

How about voting out the New York politicians?

HA! Congress has had a sub-20% approval rating for years now, and how many of them lost their jobs?

 

[Feign]

Would any of you in the "he got what he deserved because he broke the law" crowd feel the same way if he was going to prison for practicing Christianity?

I haven't thought of firearm rights in this manner, but you're absolutely right.

How do you propose to fight them?

Introduce new legislation? It will get tabled by the democratic leadership.

Sue for your rights in court? The federal circuit court has already ruled on this, and your right no longer exists. And that's if the case isn't thrown out for lack of "standing."

How do you get standing? You have to break the law and risk jail. "Risk" is used tongue in cheek. Jail is a foregone conclusion.

Unfortunately "It's not time yet" is the only thing we have. Maybe after SCOTUS rules on the Chicago case there will be a chance. Until then there is nothing.

How about voting out the New York politicians?

HA! Congress has had a sub-20% approval rating for years now, and how many of them lost their jobs?

Let me quote the important part of this:

How do you propose to fight them?

Missing person reports of higher-ups by something akin to a mob of free people would be a start. I am not advocating the use of high speed lead creating equipment or hand operated wooden/steel weaponry, but I'll say one thing; s***'s effective in other countries.

 

[Bill of Rights]

The "law" is wrong in that he should not have had to conceal it to carry it, nor register it, nor have a permit for it. How it came to the attention of "authorities" is immaterial.

I cannot find it, but I recall a quote, I believe from a Supreme Court Justice, to the effect that something with the color of law that violates the Constitution is not a law at all. If that was being practiced, there would be no argument, no arrest, no trial, conviction, or jail time, because if he had chosen to carry, there would be no law restricting his right to do so.

Personally, I am of the opinion that if that was the case, he would likely not have thought he needed to carry, because society would likely be much safer, as Heinlein postulated.

Any quote experts out there recall the one I referenced?

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Hornett]

Let's review. He took a gun into a night club - with no license to carry - without a holster, tucked into the waistband of his pants. As he was walking up some stairs, his unsecured pistol started falling down his pant leg, so he reached down to "catch" it and inadvertently pulled the trigger and shot himself. He was then charged with illegal possession of a handgun.

Does anyone know what kind of gun it was.
It would have had to be a revolver, glock, XD, or something without a safety.
Carrying that in your waistband is DUMB

I don't care how ridiculous NY's gun laws are - can anyone seriously condone this behavior? He was completely irresponsible and any legitimate gun owner should be offended by his conduct.

Gunlawyer