INGO Challenge = Proof

[shibumiseeker]

I really appreciate your maturity in this matter. It really is a shame you guys couldn't take this seriously. Shows your true colors, makes you no worse than the liberals you so strongly oppose. I really thought you guys were better than that. Such a shame.

It's hard to take a demagogue seriously, or his or her followers.

I don't oppose liberals. I oppose some ideas or political positions. It just so happens that some liberals hold those positions or ideals and some conservatives hold them.

Your little tantrum about not being taken seriously reflects poorly on you. The denizens of Ingo are not your personal body politic to do your whims. Just because other folks don't want to play your game doesn't mean we've disgraced ourselves. If you really want to be taken seriously, I suggest you post on 4chan...

 

[shibumiseeker]

So is gravity still just a theory then?

Yes, actually it is. It's a well tested theory, but it is only a theory.

 

[dross]

I really appreciate your maturity in this matter. It really is a shame you guys couldn't take this seriously. Shows your true colors, makes you no worse than the liberals you so strongly oppose. I really thought you guys were better than that. Such a shame.

I tried to explain the problem to you.

I'm not going to go out and:

1. Find an assertion made by one of these guys
2. Read his evidence.
3. Refute his evidence.

If you want participation, pick an issue yourself, lay out the evidence he provides to support that assertion. If you do that, I'll respond.

Also, you keep using the word, "proof." As someone else pointed out, you're not going to have proof for any of these things, and certainly not proof that an assertion is wrong. You can't prove a negative, as I've explained.

Present evidence, I'll agree or refute.

 

[Srtsi4wd]

The Alex Jones Machine - Round 2

A line of demarcation needs to be draw between Alex Jones and the subjects he talks about. I stopped listening to him 2 years ago.
His show is long on his opinion and he is the WORST interviewer EVER.
The content of his show is lacking, however the subjects he speaks about are valid and should be pursued.

Here are some links:

GMO Food:

Home - Seeds of Deception

Genetically Manipulated Crops: The GMO Catastrophe in the USA. A Lesson for the World

Sugar Beets- Monsanto Wins Again - BlackListed News

Junk food-addicted rats chose to starve themselves rather than eat healthy food

Economic Collapse / American Decline:

Neithercorp Press Blog Archive The Purpose Behind Engineered Economic Collapse

18 Signs That America Is Rotting Right In Front Of Our Eyes - BlackListed News

Wall Street Fraud:

http://peacerevolution.podomatic.com/enclosure/2010-05-18T16_27_48-07_00.mp3 (Peace Revolution episode 005: OVERSTOCKED / How Naked Short-Selling and Counterfeiting Stocks Create Cascading Economic Failures / an Interview with Dr. Patrick Byrne, CEO of Overstock dot com)

Police State:

Tales from Stasiland: The letter that makes you disappear—By Scott Horton (Harper's Magazine)

It Is Now Official - The US Is A Police State

Peak Oil?

Oil - We'll Never Run Out
USGS Release: 3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana’s Bakken Formation—25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate— (4/10/2008 2:25:36 PM)


True journalism is not extinct yet. There are still sources out there.

The Corbett Report
BlackListed News
Jeff Rense Program
AllGov - Everything Our Government Really Does
Foreign Policy Journal

Read this:
Why Americans Will Believe Almost Anything

Learn terms like Trivium and Hegelian Dialectic. Come to your own conclusions and respond accordingly. Keep an open mind, just don't let your brain fall out.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Peak Oil?

Oil - We'll Never Run Out
USGS Release: 3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana’s Bakken Formation—25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate— (4/10/2008 2:25:36 PM)

Ha. I refuted this one with good evidence from geologists I know from the oil patch, here on Ingo months ago. If this is an example of his "investigation" then it was very poorly done.

 

[dross]

Neithercorp Press Blog Archive The Purpose Behind Engineered Economic Collapse

I read this one closely. All he does is present evidence that the collapse could have been consciously brought about. That's not the only element he needs to make his case. The more important element, and the one he ignores, is evidence that they did actually engineer it.

This is like the Bush lied argument. They claimed he lied because he was wrong (I don't agree, btw) about WMD. For him to have lied, being wrong was only one element, and the least important. To assert he lied, you had to present evidence that he KNEW there was no WMD.

This is a common technique. It works, especially for the economic collapse, because you can present a mountain of evidence for one of the elements mixed with assertions about the other element. Most people won't notice if you never provide evidence for the other required element. Glen Beck does this quite often. I don't know about Alex Jones, I've never listened to him.

 

[djl02]

Why would anyone want to collapse an economy?Alex says they are,but heres one thing I have a problem with. He and others say get away from paper money.Buy gold,yet their receiving paper money for their gold. This doesnt make sense. Know what I mean Vern?

 

[printcraft]

HEY, who says I'm not serious with these facts?
The articles linked ARE facts.

Why are my theories not taken seriously, because I don't have a radio show??

 

[IndySSD]

When I first heard Alex Jones I thought he was a complete crackpot.

I've listened to probably 10 or so shows of his in the last 5 years and seen a couple of his movies ( Youtube infowars/prisonplanet I think) and I think he's a sensationalist (Being a sensationalist doesn't make him wrong though, just hard to rely on) .

That being said, even if 5% of what he says is anywhere near accurate then there are definitely issues that people need to be paying attention to.

My philosophy in regards to this type of subject is very rarely is anyone EVER 100% right.... Even more rarely is anyone ever 100% WRONG.


My bottom line for people like Beck and Jones .....

Knowledge is power, research everything independently and don't take ANYONES word for granted on anything.

 

[SilentWarrior1]

Knowledge is power, research everything independently and don't take ANYONES word for granted on anything.

This.

Look guys, I'm a pretty rational guy. When I started reading into this New World Order/One world Gooberment/blah blah blah that these two ramble on about. Admittedly, I was a pretty staunch Glenn Beck watcher for while, and Jones... well, I have to say he was pretty well out there to turn me off from jump. But, to be fair, I listened.

Neither of them provided any solid evidence that could point them into the realm of being "right". They threw up things here, numbers there, and a bunch of Blah Blah. No cited sources that I, as a viewer and free-thinker, could access myself.

Unless they give me the ability to see, touch, hear, feel, and study MYSELF... It is effectively Heresay and doesn't convince me to be right, wrong, or indifferent.

Give me something tangible. Then we'll talk.

 

[SavageEagle]

Well, I hope that people will at least TRY to take my challenge here. Try to prove them wrong and present it here. I don't care anymore if they've proven their case. Show me evidence that they're wrong. Challenge YOURSELF to look at things from all the angles whether its against your belief system or not. Push yourself through the anger and rage and see if you can make a counter argument against yourself on the issue.

That is my point with this thread.

Everyone is going on and on and on that Jones or Beck haven't PROVEN their side. I don't care. PROVE THEM WRONG. Entertainment or not, I don't care. I want to see them proven wrong. Show me your evidence.

Show me the money!
SHOW ME THE MONEY!
I LOVE BLACK PEOPLE!

Oh, sorry, got caught up in the moment.

 

[dross]

Well, I hope that people will at least TRY to take my challenge here. Try to prove them wrong and present it here. I don't care anymore if they've proven their case. Show me evidence that they're wrong. Challenge YOURSELF to look at things from all the angles whether its against your belief system or not. Push yourself through the anger and rage and see if you can make a counter argument against yourself on the issue.

That is my point with this thread.

Everyone is going on and on and on that Jones or Beck haven't PROVEN their side. I don't care. PROVE THEM WRONG. Entertainment or not, I don't care. I want to see them proven wrong. Show me your evidence.

Show me the money!
SHOW ME THE MONEY!
I LOVE BLACK PEOPLE!

Oh, sorry, got caught up in the moment.

Wake up and listen! You CAN'T prove someone wrong on the basis of their unsupported assertions! It is their job to prove their own assertions.

None of these things can be proven right or wrong.

Assertion: There is life on other planets.
Evidence: UFOs have been sighted. Roswell. Area 51.

Now, did I prove my case? I either did or I didn't.

Now, prove me wrong.

It's IM-FREAKING-POSSIBLE!!! Do you get that?!

You can't prove a NEGATIVE!!!!

It is the job of the person asserting to prove his case or not. Your entire premise is built on a fallacious notion that someone can prove them wrong. No one can, and it's not because they are right. They may be right and they may be wrong, but they can't be proven to be wrong. The only way they can be proven wrong is if they present a fact that is verifiably wrong, and even then it's only that one fact that is wrong. It doesn't mean they are not still right in their conclusion, just that one of their many premeses is wrong.

I don't know how to make this any clearer to you. You can't prove a negative.

 

[printcraft]

dross!!!

Turn off your webcam - I can see in your house!!!

<----- dross

 

[dross]

dross!!!

Turn off your webcam - I can see in your house!!!

<----- dross

Yes, that captures my frustration perfectly. Is it just me?

 

[SavageEagle]

Yes, that captures my frustration perfectly. Is it just me?

So if I say the earth is flat... you can't prove me wrong? Come on. You can do better than that.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

I just listened to Alex Jones on Teutonic Zionism.... Is that real SE?

 

[SavageEagle]

I just listened to Alex Jones on Teutonic Zionism.... Is that real SE?

I have no idea what that is. Like I said, I rarely ever listen to him.

 

[Lars]

So if I say the earth is flat... you can't prove me wrong? Come on. You can do better than that.

Provide evidence the earth is flat. We'll happily refute.

 

[SavageEagle]

Semantics again.....

I get it. No one wants to do the leg work. It's ok. I UNDERSTAND.

 

[Yeah]

No actually, you don't.