gun in locked car out of sight ok effective 01 july 2014

[mShu7]

I wasn't clear if this was answered in an earlier post, but does a school corporation now have to "approve" this for it to be ok on their school grounds? I work for a school corp but I'm not sure I'm 100% ok to keep it in my vehicle at this point, despite the new law.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I wasn't clear if this was answered in an earlier post, but does a school corporation now have to "approve" this for it to be ok on their school grounds? I work for a school corp but I'm not sure I'm 100% ok to keep it in my vehicle at this point, despite the new law.

Interesting question. Prior to today, an employer other than a school (and a few other GFZs) could not legally punish you for locking your gun in the trunk as its considered your private property. IANAL but I think the law that took effect today might cover you under the other law's umbrella. I can as a visitor, I dont see why you cant as an employee.

 

[John Galt]

I wasn't clear if this was answered in an earlier post, but does a school corporation now have to "approve" this for it to be ok on their school grounds? I work for a school corp but I'm not sure I'm 100% ok to keep it in my vehicle at this point, despite the new law.

You do not need approval from anyone. I am 100% sure.

 

[mShu7]

Thanks.

 

[brotherbill3]

UGH ... It is Engrossed SB 229 that is in effect - not HB 1048 - (much the same, but not "EXACTLY") ...

Only students allowed / covered / protected / exempted - are those who are
1) on THE school's shooting team (if they have one, 26 in the state)
2) Given WRITTEN permission - I think by principal (could be school board)
3) ON days of MATCH or PRACTICE.

Regular adults (LTCH) that are NOT students (and have not been expelled) are all covered by this.
if you've been expelled - then you are not covered by this for 2 yrs.

There maybe more stuff in there; well there is, but i don't have time now.

(see yesterday's post by Indiana Moms Against Gun Control via Facebook) ...

 

[Lex Concord]

PRIVATE businesses do not have a right to discriminate, correct?

Heart of Atlanta Motel v. United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Please explain how proscription of a particular act or acts by a private business is discrimination as outlined by the act.

 

[sj kahr k40]

People promised me this bill would lead to shootings in the parking lot, are those going to happen now or do I have to wait till school is in session?

 

[Redhorse]

People promised me this bill would lead to shootings in the parking lot, are those going to happen now or do I have to wait till school is in session?

Go to a school and lock your gun in your car and find out. Everyone knows guns kill people all by themselves.

 

[mShu7]

Go to a school and lock your gun in your car and find out. Everyone knows guns kill people all by themselves.

I've been at work (school) for a little while. So far, no shootings have occurred even though I've heard someone has their gun locked in their vehicle.

 

[lonehoosier]

I keep hearing people referring the LTCH with this new law. From my understanding of this law it provides a "PROPER PERSON" to store a gun in their car weather if it is a pistol or a rifle. If I am wrong please show me. Thank you.

 

[CathyInBlue]

I know the law says this will be ok tomorrow on school property. What about the other gfz like a child care?

No. SB 229 http://iga.in.gov/static-documents/6/6/6/6/66663bcd/SB0229.04.ENRS.pdf (wow, that's a lot more than just 3 sixes) explicitly leaves in place the prohibition on firearms on the property of: a child care center, an emergency shelter, a group home, or a private secure facility.

All I got is employers who run businesses out of their homes like hair stylists or maybe a backyard mechanic. Home based businesses?

I believe that modification was caused by the case of one of INGO's own, who was (and still is) a security guard. He had his rifle locked in his car in the employee parking lot, but because his job meant he might have to drive that car to apartment complexes, the original language of "a person's residence" meant he couldn't avail himself of the protections of this statute. By changing that language to explicitly refer to the employer's residence, if he were to find himself in the same predicament, he would now be golden, since he'd have his rifle locked in the trunk of his car at the residence of someone other than his employer.

I keep hearing people referring the LTCH with this new law. From my understanding of this law it provides a "PROPER PERSON" to store a gun in their car weather if it is a pistol or a rifle. If I am wrong please show me. Thank you.

I can find no reference to "proper person" in the language of the bill linked above. Keep in mind two things: 1) This is not wholly new law. It's a repeal of existing law. [STRIKE]As such, it doesn't really add any new language.[/STRIKE] If mere proper personhood was sufficient before, it would be sufficient now, but it wasn't, so it isn't. 2) There's still the federal GFSZ law to contend with. If you have a firearm on public property within 1000 ft of a school and you're not licensed by your state of residence, you're in violation of federal law and an instant felon.

 

[lonehoosier]

No. SB 229 http://iga.in.gov/static-documents/6/6/6/6/66663bcd/SB0229.04.ENRS.pdf (wow, that's a lot more than just 3 sixes) explicitly leaves in place the prohibition on firearms on the property of: a child care center, an emergency shelter, a group home, or a private secure facility.

I believe that modification was caused by the case of one of INGO's own, who was (and still is) a security guard. He had his rifle locked in his car in the employee parking lot, but because his job meant he might have to drive that car to apartment complexes, the original language of "a person's residence" meant he couldn't avail himself of the protections of this statute. By changing that language to explicitly refer to the employer's residence, if he were to find himself in the same predicament, he would now be golden, since he'd have his rifle locked in the trunk of his car at the residence of someone other than his employer.

I can find no reference to "proper person" in the language of the bill linked above. Keep in mind two things: 1) This is not wholly new law. It's a repeal of existing law. As such, it doesn't really add any new language. If mere proper personhood was sufficient before, it would be sufficient now, but it wasn't, so it isn't. 2) There's still the federal GFSZ law to contend with. If you have a firearm on public property within 1000 ft of a school and you're not licensed by your state of residence, you're in violation of federal law and an instant felon.

So would kids bringing their own rifles for the shooting team be a instant felon then under the federal GFSZ law?

 

[CathyInBlue]

I don't know enough about the federal GFSZ Act to be able to opine intelligently. I think there might be a proviso therein for people given permission by a school official, which this Indiana law requires as well, for students in shooting clubs.

 

[1775usmarine]

So this means Norfolk Southern which operates nationally can't deny me from leaving my firearm under the seat out of plain sight?

 

[CathyInBlue]

So this means Norfolk Southern which operates nationally can't deny me from leaving my firearm under the seat out of plain sight?

There's a whole other statute that governs railroads WRT the guns in vehicles statute.

And lonehoosier, I think I've found the source of the confusion you referenced. there is new language added:

IC 35-47-9-1(a)
This chapter does not apply to the following:
[…]
(5) Except as provided in subsection (b) or (c), a person who:
(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses only a firearm that is:
(i) locked in the trunk of the person's motor vehicle;
(ii) kept in the glove compartment of the person's locked motor vehicle; or
(iii) stored out of plain sight in the person's locked motor vehicle.

So, if you have a rifle, you may freely carry that anywhere including driving into the parking lot of a school, however, it would still run you afoul of the GFSZA. Also, if you're unlicensed, but carrying in accordance with the Indiana unlicensed transport statute, but there's still the GFSZA. Or, if you're carryng a cap-and-ball revolver, but GFSZA.

And again, this is not a "proper person". Just people not legally prohibitted from possession of firearms.

My question is, you're licensed, you're carrying (nevermind how), and you pull into the parking lot of your child's school, and you park. Now, at this point, you're still covered by the pared down IC 35-47-9-1(a)(3). Let's say for argument's sake that there is no glovebox or hidden spaces in your car's cabin, and you have no articles with which you can cover the firearm while it's sitting in the cabin, or that your car's door locks don't work. Your only option is the trunk. How does one legally exit the vehicle, open the trunk, and deposit said firearm in the trunk in order to comply with this law? There should be language about transport as directly as practicable to the trunk.

 

[1775usmarine]

There's a whole other statute that governs railroads WRT the guns in vehicles statute.

And lonehoosier, I think I've found the source of the confusion you referenced. there is new language added:


So, if you have a standard rifle, you may freely carry that anywhere, however, it would still run you afoul of the GFSZA. Also, if you're unlicensed, but carrying in accordance with the Indiana unlicensed transport statute, but there's still the GFSZA. Or, if you're OCing a cap-and-ball revolver, but GFSZA.

And again, this is not a "proper person". Just people not legally prohibitted from possession of firearms.

My question is, you're licensed, you're carrying (nevermind how), and you pull into the parking lot of your child's school, and you park. Now, at this point, you're still covered by the pared down IC 35-47-9-1(a)(3). Let's say for argument's sake that there is no glovebox or hidden spaces in your car's cabin, and you have no articles with which you can cover the firearm while it's sitting in the cabin. Your only option is the trunk. How does one legally exit the vehicle, open the trunk, and deposit said firearm in the trunk in order to comply with this law? There should be language about transport as directly as practicable to the trunk.

You stuff it down your pants leg and cover with your shirt. Then you get in the trunk and remove said rifle. Anyone asks you are handicapped and getting your invisible wheelchair.

 

[CathyInBlue]

Aw geez! There goes that mental health issue again!

Another aw geez! moment. Apparently, the in.gov website is abandonning the http://www.in.gov/ic/code/ url. It's no longer updating to changed statutes. For instance, it only shows the old form of IC 35-47-9-1. Now, you have to go to https://iga.in.gov/legislative/laws/2015/ic/ to get the current laws, and even then, it's not exactly coherent (THANKS PL 168-2014!). It now shows at https://iga.in.gov/legislative/laws/2015/ic/titles/035/articles/047/chapters/009/ both versions of IC 35-47-9-2, the one with SB 229 stuff in it that establishes an A-Misd, and the one without the SB 229 stuff that now makes it a 6-Felony. Which one governs? Apparently, BOTH!

There also doesn't appear to be any way to get at HTML renditions of the code. Just screwy PDFs with NBSPs that screw with my copy and pasting. The keyword search of the code is in the top banner on the right.

 

[lonehoosier]

There's a whole other statute that governs railroads WRT the guns in vehicles statute.

And lonehoosier, I think I've found the source of the confusion you referenced. there is new language added:



So, if you have a rifle, you may freely carry that anywhere including driving into the parking lot of a school, however, it would still run you afoul of the GFSZA. Also, if you're unlicensed, but carrying in accordance with the Indiana unlicensed transport statute, but there's still the GFSZA. Or, if you're carryng a cap-and-ball revolver, but GFSZA.

And again, this is not a "proper person". Just people not legally prohibitted from possession of firearms.

My question is, you're licensed, you're carrying (nevermind how), and you pull into the parking lot of your child's school, and you park. Now, at this point, you're still covered by the pared down IC 35-47-9-1(a)(3). Let's say for argument's sake that there is no glovebox or hidden spaces in your car's cabin, and you have no articles with which you can cover the firearm while it's sitting in the cabin, or that your car's door locks don't work. Your only option is the trunk. How does one legally exit the vehicle, open the trunk, and deposit said firearm in the trunk in order to comply with this law? There should be language about transport as directly as practicable to the trunk.

Yes that's exactly where I got the whole proper person thing. I also remember during all the floor hearing that question came up about rifles and I could've sworn that one of the sponsors of the bill said as long as you are proper person you could have a handgun or rifle stored in your vehicle. I wish we could've gotten recorded video of those hearings.

As for the whole trunk thing I can only assume that you would park off property stick your firearm in the trunk to secure it and then drive onto the property.

 

[brotherbill3]

Yes that's exactly where I got the whole proper person thing. I also remember during all the floor hearing that question came up about rifles and I could've sworn that one of the sponsors of the bill said as long as you are proper person you could have a handgun or rifle stored in your vehicle. I wish we could've gotten recorded video of those hearings.

As for the whole trunk thing I can only assume that you would park off property stick your firearm in the trunk to secure it and then drive onto the property.

I think you are correct - about hearing the Proper Person
... I suppose the answer could be interpreted that an "IMPROPER PERSON" is one prohibited from possession of firearms (period)
... therefore the one who 'May Legally possess a firearm" ... is a proper person and is anyone who is NOT "improper" ...

As to getting out tof the car - that is a no no; as would unholstering or moving / "possessing" a firearm to the 'locked trunk' ...
yes it is dumb (IMO) - hopefully something that can be corrected the next session.
The problem being you need to really word smith the right answer and it might take a total redo of the IC regarding Firearms. ...

Not sure what to say about the ever devolving web-site(s) of the IGA. ...

 

[CathyInBlue]

Proper person is only relevant for the ability to receive an LTCH. It has nothing whatsoever to do with long guns or secure container in the trunk on the way to the range, so in that, proper personhood has nothing to do with the guns in locked vehicles in school parking lots.