Front Sight Institute Using Deputy's Death Video For Advertising

[Buckaroo]

I have no problem with this video used as a training tool. In a private class room. I have astronomical issues with it being used as a marketing tool!

I agree

 

[Buckaroo]

Buckaroo, while I totally agree with you on this post I must tell you that you really must contain your disgust when typing a letter. No one is going to read past your first line and the message will be lost in the circular file. Too badd too because the rest of your note was very good.

You are correct sir, if I had any hope that this man or his organization might be responsive I would have worded my correspondence differently. Due to his style and practices both in the past and currently I did not expect them to care.

Buckaroo

 

[bat54r]

Seeing that vid used has a marketing tool disgusts me to no end. Front sight and that tool running it need to simply go away.

 

[homeless]

Don't ever be surprised by any thing Piazza does, he is a Scientologist after all.

 

[TheDude]

Somebody at least tell me that that POS was caught.

 

[Jim W.]

Ok, I have to admit that I was looking at frontsight for training. But alas there is no way I could afford it. Heck I can't afford the cost of all the amo you would be using.

With the above said. Who and where locally would you all suggest for someone to train that is cost effective.

Jim

 

[Steve MI]

ACT with rhino and crew is a good bet as well as shay with mindset labs

we MDFI are back again in june

 

[TiminMishawaka]

Guys wake up. This isn't marketing. This is the passionate owner of a company who poured his life into teaching people how to kill dirtbags like the one in this video who watched this video and was outraged by it and put his thoughts on it in his private blog and published it.....WHILE GIVING FREE ADVICE ON WHAT TO DO IN THIS SITUATION!!!!

Good grief....he didn't owe any of you a freaking word of his opinion but he gave it freely and you're spitting it right back into his face because he dares to own a business in a capitalist country. And why the focus on just frontsight? This video is being used by thousands of websites to generate web traffic....which is online marketing.

 

[HandK]

My thoughts on the Frontsight organization have been belabored enough, but this is a new low even for them.

I have seen this video, like others here, many times before. It has been used by a good many instructors (some even on this board) as a training tool. I have no issues with that use of this kind of video. Although difficult to watch, and even harder to critique, I think we owe it to the memory of the officers involved in these types of events, and their families to learn all we can to prevent it from happening again. We owe it to those we will train in the future to be ruthlessly critical of everyone’s actions whenever we have a chance to learn from this type of incident.

The problem is when (as Frontsight has chosen to do here) it turns into a marketing or profiteering review, you’re no longer respecting the sacrifices made by those involved, or the losses of their family. I expect more from those “in the business” but sadly, there are those who don’t understand that respect.

Of course they weren't getting any of my business anyway, this is just one more reason why.

Tinman....

This!!! Plus one when I get some rep!!

 

[Buckaroo]

Guys wake up. This isn't marketing. This is the passionate owner of a company who poured his life into teaching people how to kill dirtbags like the one in this video who watched this video and was outraged by it and put his thoughts on it in his private blog and published it.....WHILE GIVING FREE ADVICE ON WHAT TO DO IN THIS SITUATION!!!!

Good grief....he didn't owe any of you a freaking word of his opinion but he gave it freely and you're spitting it right back into his face because he dares to own a business in a capitalist country. And why the focus on just frontsight? This video is being used by thousands of websites to generate web traffic....which is online marketing.

You sir need to wake up and see Dr. Ignatius Piazza for who he is!

Take a look at his business practices and you will see that he is a crook!

Buckaroo

 

[DissonantEscapist]

Guys wake up. This isn't marketing. This is the passionate owner of a company who poured his life into teaching people how to kill dirtbags like the one in this video who watched this video and was outraged by it and put his thoughts on it in his private blog and published it.....WHILE GIVING FREE ADVICE ON WHAT TO DO IN THIS SITUATION!!!!

Good grief....he didn't owe any of you a freaking word of his opinion but he gave it freely and you're spitting it right back into his face because he dares to own a business in a capitalist country. And why the focus on just frontsight? This video is being used by thousands of websites to generate web traffic....which is online marketing.

No, Tim, this is a scumbag crying crocodile tears to make himself some more money. There are other places with a longer, more positive history if you have to go to a big-name training facility, and there are more honest, new places as well.

 

[pierce195]

I'm sorry but this video has nothing to do with what he is teaching. I have yet so see any firearms training company on this forum or other quility school use these tactics, because they are above that.

Like I said before this video is useful in teaching, but not to scare students in to coming to your school.

I would personal have nothing to do with this company. Even if he came to Indiana and offered a free school.

 

[hickuleas]

Totally wrong and i hope Front Sight goes out of business soon.

 

[MWinez]

He is a low life .

 

[TiminMishawaka]

You sir need to wake up and see Dr. Ignatius Piazza for who he is!

Take a look at his business practices and you will see that he is a crook!

Buckaroo

I'm willing to keep an open mind. You repped me down for not going along with the group thinking, so show me you have the shoulders to back this statement up with documented facts. You have accused him of being a crook. Now back it up. Again, I'm very willing to keep an open mind if you can show me this with documented facts.

 

[TiminMishawaka]

No, Tim, this is a scumbag crying crocodile tears to make himself some more money.

From looking at how much money he's been able to donate, it sounds like he doesn't need this to make money.

Why don't we just skip past all this BS rage pointed at Piazza for the sin of making money and look at the core issue here. When you read his blog....he is absolutely right about what should have been done here. Someone trained this officer to keep talking instead of using completely justifiable lethal force sooner and that is wrong. There's more rage being thrown at Piazza than whoever it is who trained this officer wrong and even the murderer himself. That's the problem I have with this thread it takes rage that should be directed at the real problems and refocuses it on Piazza for daring to comment on it. It follows the same pattern liberals use to attack Limbaugh or Beck when they voice their opinions on a tragedy. Focus on the enemy here guys.

 

[pierce195]

Anyone teaching in the world of firearms would tell you this officer should have shoot him. I don't need his teaching for that.

This issue was with the department that had threated to reprimand him for excessive use of force for another incident that was not warranted. The training issue is just that, this young officer was worried about his department suspending or firing him.

This video has nothing to do with what you will learn from Frontsight unless he is teaching a class to law enforcement administrators. That class should cover what not to do when teaching young officers about the use of force in the line of their duties.

I hate the way this video was used period.

 

[Buckaroo]

I'm willing to keep an open mind. You repped me down for not going along with the group thinking, so show me you have the shoulders to back this statement up with documented facts. You have accused him of being a crook. Now back it up. Again, I'm very willing to keep an open mind if you can show me this with documented facts.

Pahrump Valley Times - Nye County's Largest Newspaper Circulation

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]At 11 a.m. Monday, Front Sight Firearms Training Institute and its president, Ignatius Piazza, went into receivership.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]All financial transactions involving the firearms training facility -- from accepting payment for classes to paying staff and vendors -- must take place through a court-appointed administrator.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The facility and all assets have been seized by the court, down to the hundreds of firearms included as part of new members' benefits.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]However, despite the ruling, this weekend at Front Sight everything was "business as usual," according to Operations Manager Rick Morello.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]He said he knew nothing about the legal proceedings. "We have a big weekend coming up with a full schedule of classes," Morello said. "Business is booming." [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The ruling, handed down by U.S. District Judge James Ware in San Jose, Calif., had its beginning in November 2005 when Stacy James, Bill Haag and Michael Schriber filed a class action suit against Piazza on behalf of themselves and other qualified Front Sight members. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The suit mentions "violations of RICO, unfair advertising and competition, Nevada Sale of Subdivided Land Act, fraudulent conveyances, Consumer Legal Remedies Act, Interstate Land Sales Full Disclosure Act, breach of contract and fraud," all based on Piazza's sale of lifetime memberships.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]RICO is the acronym for the federal Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act, originally used to target the Mafia and similar organizations.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The three men allege the price of the memberships they and the members of the class purchased were artificially inflated as a result of misrepresentations and non-disclosures.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]On October 15, 2007, a settlement was reached and Ware dismissed the suit with the stipulation Front Sight live up to the negotiated terms. A settlement fund of $8,050,000 secured by a lien on Front Sight's assets would let the class foreclose if the fund was not fully funded by October 15, 2008.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Piazza was ordered to put 10 percent of Front Sight's monthly gross revenues into the settlement fund and provide financial documentation showing he was meeting his obligation. He complied, although according to the plaintiff's court filings, the payments were not timely, which comes as no surprise to former employees and suppliers in Pahrump.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The settlement also said Piazza had to allow members who were part of the suit to use their Front Sight memberships until the settlement fund was fully paid. Further, he was ordered by the court not to retaliate or make derogatory remarks against James, Haag and Schriber. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]According to C. Keith Greer, attorney for the class, Piazza violated all the agreed upon terms. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]At the end of the prescribed year, the fund was short by more than $5.4 million.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The day after the fund came up short, Piazza send a letter to everyone involved in the suit, saying Front Sight was no longer obligated to make additional monthly payments because the class action had forced the first mortgage holder on the property to foreclose.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"This is a lie as no one foreclosed on the property on that day or any day since," said Greer.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Piazza's letter also said Front Sight offered to increase its monthly contribution to the settlement fund from 10 to 20 percent.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Greer said bluntly, "That was also a lie."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]But Piazza didn't stop there. He told class members they were "forever banned from Front Sight," which was another violation of the terms.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]The same day Piazza sent a letter to non-class members, declaring:[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"After they attended over 200 Front Sight Courses and pocketed $830,000 out of the first million dollars I paid timely into the Class Action Settlement Fund, the three malcontents and their ambulance-chasing attorney tried to kill Front Sight and terminate your membership by forcing us into foreclosure. So I cut them (and their followers) off at the knees![/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"In this letter I reveal all the gory details and show you how the new Front Sight turned the tables on these back-stabbing saboteurs."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]According to Greer, "Defendant Piazza also boasts that, in violation of the court order against encumbering the property, he created Front Sight Management II and signed a 99-year lease with the old Front Sight entity, leasing the land, water rights, entitlements, equipment, weapons, licenses, trademarks, copyrights, intellectual property, Internet sites, accounts, etc. Every asset the old Front Sight had is now leased by the new Front Sight entity."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Greer said it is clear Front Sight "violated every aspect of the court order and settlement agreement."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]He added that Piazza did so "notoriously" and "in a manner that flaunts disrespect for the law and the judicial system."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Piazza's gorilla marketing technique of sending frequent e-mails with special price offers to prospective members give Greer and his clients easy access to information. They used Piazza's own words as evidence to show the court Piazza and Front Sight have the money to satisfy the settlement obligation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]On December 30, 2008, Piazza e-mailed members saying Front Sight had doubled in students, members and net worth each year for 12 years. He said, "While others are laying off people, we are hiring." He also said Front Sight had been offered a $25 million letter of credit.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Taking Piazza at his printed word, in March, the class asked to have Piazza appear in court with financial documentation Piazza agreed to supply in the settlement agreement. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]In fact, Greer asked Piazza to live up to all the stipulations in the settlement, including paying the claims administrator and stopping interference with the membership rights of class members. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Greer also asked the court to order Piazza to stop publishing disparaging remarks about class members.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ware granted the request, setting the hearing date for date for March 23. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Piazza did not appear, nor did he send any representative to appear on Front Sight's behalf. He did, however, fire his attorney at the last minute, which the judge called an "eleventh-hour dismissal" when he issued an order for Piazza to show cause why he should not be held in contempt of court and subject to sanctions for failing to appear.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]That hearing to show cause was held Monday, resulting in Ware's decision that Front Sight had defaulted on its agreement with the class. All assets belonging to Front Sight and Piazza were seized by the court.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]An administrator was appointed to run the organization. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica] [/FONT]

Buckaroo

 

[Kick]

Somebody at least tell me that that POS was caught.

He was caught. The offender really was a combat veteran and the war messed him up pretty good. There is A LOT of backround that the sick and twisted ad did not mention. I first saw that video on my first day at the academy. It is part of a training series " In the Line of Duty ". In all honesty, I was not too happy that they showed the video there but, throughout training, I cannot tell you how many videos I have seen like this one and this is by far one of the most disturbing.

I can almost understand looking at the material in a private class. One instructor asked me if I would want other officers to learn from my mistakes so that thier lives could possibly be saved. After he put it that way, I feel a little better about it in private training.

 

[IndyGunSafety]

Ok, I have to admit that I was looking at frontsight for training. But alas there is no way I could afford it. Heck I can't afford the cost of all the amo you would be using.

With the above said. Who and where locally would you all suggest for someone to train that is cost effective.

Jim

My costs are reasonable (this is the 8th year without an increase!) and I give a $25 discount when you sign up 2 people. I offer the NRA's Basic Pistol Course and an Advanced Course which focuses on concealed carry. See my advertiser forum for info, or Indy Gun Safety Home.