FOIA - Not!

[Plinker]

Under Freedom of Information proposal, agencies could say records don't exist - The Denver Post

A proposed change to the Freedom of Information Act would allow federal agencies to tell people requesting certain law- enforcement or national-security documents that rec ords don't exist, even when they do.​

If this passes any government agency can in essence, lie about whether a document exists. And the water in the pot gets a little hotter...

 

[CarmelHP]

Outrageous

 

[88GT]

Outrageous

At this point, there's really not much more to say....out loud.

Suddenly the phrase "That only happens in places like the Soviet Union" take on a eerie quality.

 

[NYFelon]

In soviet russia, document hide you

 

[badwolf.usmc]

So instead of telling people that they can't confirm or deny that the documents exists when they get rejected, they will just tell people that they don't exist when they get rejected?

I'm not so much upset that they would deny that the document exists, but the change in attitude that this rule will create.

 

[Stschil]

I tried to read the link, but all I got was an "This web site does not exist" on DoJ letterhead.......

 

[NYFelon]

I tried to read the link, but all I got was an "This web site does not exist" on DoJ letterhead.......

HA!

 

[level.eleven]

Huh, I guess Wikileaks and Anon were ahead of the curve.

Is this really a change though? A piece over at the Daily Caller has some info from the Reagan DOJ saying the exact same thing.

“Where an exclusion is employed, the agency is legally empowered to ‘treat’ the excluded records as not subject to the FOIA at all,” Meese wrote. “Accordingly, a requester can properly be advised in such a situation that “there exist no records responsive to your FOIA request.” Such phrasing — as opposed to any more detailed statement that, for example, any records specified in a particular request ‘could not be located’ — most rationally and fairly implements an exclusion’s effect.”

FOIA | Department of Justice | Transparency | The Daily Caller

http://www.justice.gov/oip/86agmemo.htm#mechanism

 

[RockofStrength]

Huh, I guess Wikileaks and Anon were ahead of the curve.

Is this really a change though? A piece over at the Daily Caller has some info from the Reagan DOJ saying the exact same thing.

“Where an exclusion is employed, the agency is legally empowered to ‘treat’ the excluded records as not subject to the FOIA at all,” Meese wrote. “Accordingly, a requester can properly be advised in such a situation that “there exist no records responsive to your FOIA request.” Such phrasing — as opposed to any more detailed statement that, for example, any records specified in a particular request ‘could not be located’ — most rationally and fairly implements an exclusion’s effect.”

FOIA | Department of Justice | Transparency | The Daily Caller

Attorney General's Memorandum on the 1986 Amendments to the FOIA

In that case, the documents may actually exist. The government is still legally unable to lie, in that case. The provision in the OP gives the government the freedom to simply lie and say that there is no document, there never was a document, and no you can't check for yourself.

 

[CVMA544]

That will make it easier for YOU or ME not to exist, Sorry we don't have him, or know anything about him.

Que the music :[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l46t_nrySg4[/ame]

 

[88GT]

That will make it easier for YOU or ME not to exist, Sorry we don't have him, or know anything about him.

Que the music

I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be a *****, but it's 'cue' not 'que.'

 

[CVMA544]

I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be a *****, but it's 'cue' not 'que.'

Well i'm guessin youz getted the idey i was a talkin bout

 

[88GT]

Well i'm guessin youz getted the idey i was a talkin bout

Yes, I knew what you meant. But you have to understand that a grammar/spelling error like that is to me what the knick-knack out of place is for the person with OCD. I'm in therapy for it, and we're making progress, but every one in a while I still revert to the old behavior. Just call me the grammar version of Monk. It's a gift, and a curse.

 

[NYFelon]

cue the queue

 

[jsharmon7]

I thought Que was a mod here. Cue Que.

 

[NYFelon]

Que's been cued. He's in the queue.

 

[CVMA544]

Yes, I knew what you meant. But you have to understand that a grammar/spelling error like that is to me what the knick-knack out of place is for the person with OCD. I'm in therapy for it, and we're making progress, but every one in a while I still revert to the old behavior. Just call me the grammar version of Monk. It's a gift, and a curse.

With me it is fractions and decimals, I was a machinst long ago, and it amazes me that people don't understand them.

I didn't lose any math abilities after the TBI, but my spelling, grammar and memory went straight down the crapper, I have to spell check even the simplest words sometimes.

Other than that I am lucky to string words together and make complete sentences, and walk and chew gum at the same time these days.

 

[bigg cheese]

Yes, I knew what you meant. But you have to understand that a grammar/spelling error like that is to me what the knick-knack out of place is for the person with OCD. I'm in therapy for it, and we're making progress, but every one in a while I still revert to the old behavior. Just call me the grammar version of Monk. It's a gift, and a curse.

You should come to my GA meetings . We all sit around and correct the local newspaper together . Then when we're done, we tap lamps for about an hour.

 

[jmiller676]

You should come to my GA meetings . We all sit around and correct the local newspaper together . Then when we're done, we tap lamps for about an hour.

 

[CarmelHP]

.... but every one in a while I still revert to the old behavior.

It's every once in a while, dear.