Does "Bugging-Out" make any sense?

[melensdad]

it's pretty naive to think that just because i live in an area that is traditionally a safe place that bad thing can't happen here...

He didn't say bad things can't happen there.

But the odds of a race riot like they had in LA happening in Carmel, IN are about as likely as NASA landing a space shuttle in downtown Chicago and calling it a successful landing on Mars.

If there is going to be an LA style race riot in the Hoosier state it will occur in an impoverished community, not in a town that has more mansions than minorities.

 

[red_zr24x4]

Wanted to add that the examples I listed earlier and this one.. the patato famin in Ireland, while people did not "flee to the woods" they did flee all that was known to them. They made the choice to leave all that they had known, all that generations of their families had know to go to the unknown and try to survive in a new land where they didnt know anyone/how they were going to survive

 

[E5RANGER375]

Preparedness I'm all for. I was asking about the specific concept of "bugging out." I've got provisions in may house and my car that will allow me to get to my house. I just want a single, historical example of anyone in a post-industrial nation packing up and fleeing at a moment's notice for any reason.

I'm not arguing, and I'm not saying that such a scenario doesn't exist, I just don't know of any. I know of several historical instances of people who stayed where they were and survived.

the ones who dont bug out are called victims. the ones who do are called survivors.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

But the government collapsing isn't going to drive me from my home. Why would it?

Civil unrest? What does that even mean? Going door to door and killing? Bring it, that's why I'm fortified at home.

As to questioning "realistic" and "perceptions," I don't really understand. Realistic meaning being of a plausible and applicable nature within the boundaries of the natural world I suppose. As to perception...I don't know, a individual understanding of a tangible or intangible concept?

Again, I'm not trying to be argumentative and I'm not questioning anyone's system.

Yes, you are being argumentative, and you appear to have an axe to grind...

But hey, I'll throw some food for thought out there.

OK - I'm going to side with Shibumiseeker on this. He mentioned civil unrest - genocide if you happen to be of the wrong background in an area. If Hotel Rwanda is too unbelievable for you....
Let's see...

1) Bosnia-Herzegovina and the ethnic cleansing
2) Jewish folks in well....a whole lot of places.

oh yeah - those were overseas... and there were routes to help them... oh and we'd NEVER do that HERE in America, right?

You may want to consult your history books, sir. Consider the Mormons who uhhh... BUGGED OUT for Utah. They had an _extermination order_ signed into law by the Governor of Missouri. They fled. Errr... BUGGED OUT. They founded the strongest town in Illinios at the time (Nauvoo). This was before Chicago's heyday. Then their leader was assassinated. Then they were driven literally out of the country.

Look - there are plenty of reasons to bug OUT. I would agree if you said that one is _most often_ served well by preparing at home. I'll BUY that. That said, any incident that makes your home base unworkable absolutely makes it necessary to bug out. The kinds of storms that do that are generally large scale catastrophes like the earthquake/tsunami combo seen in Japan or Katrina (warning granted in THAT case, not so with Japan). Or they are cultural/political/genocidal. Shibumiseeker mentioned this. And he's NOT mistaken. You are welcome to ignore history at your own peril, sir. I choose not to.

Or are you saying that you'd stand and fight the whole state National Guard, or the US Army? That's the choice that the Mormons, the Jews, the Hutus (or Tutsi's... I forget), etc. faced... At some point, sir - bugging out makes sense. Yes, in a small enough conflict it's fine to fight. But let's say I was a [insert ethnic group here], and I had another area of the country where the numbers were in my favor. OK- let's say I was a Mormon today. And a similar thing occurred. All of the local folks decided that the "Mormons have to go..." Would it NOT be smart for me to "bug out" to say Utah or Idaho??? Where there is much more strength in numbers? And I would not be persecuted for my beliefs?

Or am I supposed to stand and fight and get my whole family exterminated???

I find sir, your analysis of history is a bit short sighted...

Consider all of the intolerance that we even hear spouted in the hallowed halls of INGO, sir. And one cannot help but understand how the racial/demographic genocide of the past could have easily happened.

Those who do not learn from history, sir, are indeed doomed to repeat it.

Just my two centavos worth, sir.

 

[rjstew317]

like i said, do what you will, no need to get on my because you don't think it necessary. OP asked for examples and i gave them

on a side not, most prep gear comes in handy for backpacking trips which i enjoy, so it's really dual purpose

 

[rjstew317]

He didn't say bad things can't happen there.

But the odds of a race riot like they had in LA happening in Carmel, IN are about as likely as NASA landing a space shuttle in downtown Chicago and calling it a successful landing on Mars.

If there is going to be an LA style race riot in the Hoosier state it will occur in an impoverished community, not in a town that has more mansions than minorities.

yeah, because indy is so far from where i live .

 

[rjstew317]

in my mansion

 

[Mr.JAG]

I have not read every post in this thread...

But just going to add that people specific situations might dictate their ability to hold fast at home or a need to bug out.

Take mine, for example.

I live alone in a small 700sq ft 1 bed room apartment, and within the 465 circle of Indy. I have no family in this city what-so-ever. My closest relatives live 2 hrs south (Spencer In).

This sort of distorts what abilities I have to defend my dwelling. It's a populated building (populated by strangers to me), and 100% electric powered. Given any unrest or significant power outages during a disaster... I'm at a fairly large disadvantage for survival.. both on the defensive ideal and basic needs ideal.

What *might* possibly create such a situation? Really got no idea.

Invasion/War from another country? Likely in the US? Probably not...

A terrorist strike on large cities? I suppose its *possible*, but those are usually hit-n-run with no sustained fighting/defense necessary or possible.

Some sort of Nuclear fall out from a bomb detonation somewhere else in the world? Maybe... I guess?

Really... it all seems a tad far fetched...

I guess my point is... IF (and its a big IF) something were to happen that required some sort of physical defense and weakened my ability to procure basic necessities (food, water, heat), I do feel as if I would have a better chance by getting the heck out of Dodge and making my way south towards Family that live in a less populated area with lots of land and homes that are still equipped with hand pump wells, septic systems, wood stoves, etc.

 

[sbcman]

Is an orderly evacuation actually "bugging out?"

Or is it just moving to a hotel for a few days? Was there civil unrest in the town while you were away? Was there looting in the town in the absence of the residents? Etc?

I suppose it was more of an evacuation. Nobody back then knew what a "bug out bag" was, so no, I couldn't have been a bugging out. If it happened today, it probably would be a bugging out scenario

There was absolutely no civil unrest because even those who might think of doing such feared getting their lungs fried more than getting some loot. Most families just gathered at the local vfd, told each other where we were planning to go, invited others to come with us and just headed out. As a youngster, it was scary, but I remember the adults being very calm about everything. Most of the town ended up at Kentucky Lake. And several of us met up there. When we came back, everything was as we had left it.

 

[Woodrow]

We don't live in the third world, and while the example of Bosnia might hold some water, let's not forget that they started World War 1 and are prone to conflict. That and the Ethnic Albanians didn't really flee. I'm sorry, but the total economic collapse and subsequent immediate break-down of society just doesn't hold water with the history of this country.

The rail car was a good example. Think small, it's much more likely and less aluminum foil hat.

 

[sbcman]

Bzzzzt. You lose for posting a real world example.

 

[rjstew317]

 

[ffemoeller]

This is about as motivating as any! I don't trust them at all! Other than this, and perhaps a nuke going of at Ft. Ben....I'm staying put.

Fifteen U.S. nuclear reactors are located in an active seismic zone | Homeland Security News Wire

 

[revance]

I haven't read all 10 pages, but in case it hasn't been posted...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r97xoSOEjM

 

[melensdad]

yeah, because indy is so far from where i live .

When the LA riots occurred they were in a very small area, they did not affect the whole city, most neighborhoods were completely unaffected. Are you saying that if Broadripple goes up in flames you honestly think that Carmel is at a serious level of risk? Seriously?

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

After reading some of the responses, I would agree that there are very few cases where bugging out makes sense. That is even more true if one takes bugging out to mean ONLY "head for the hills and fire up the generator, Erma"... That said, if that is what you wanted to get across, Woodrow - I would never say "never". There are a few cases (beaten to death and mentioned above) where it indeed would be advantageous to abandon one's home and head for a destination that may hold a far better future. That is, after all the reason for most all migration in history. Some of it was brought on gradually (potato famine) and some quickly (some of the genocidal examples mentioned). But in all cases people decided that their odds were better and they were freer if they bugged out. I've got to believe that you were thinking of the more _stereotypical/hollywood_ bug out scenario... I find the scenarios mentioned above far more plausible/likely etc...

Also I don't think that the economic problems are what would drive people to bug out directly so much. Far more likely that the economic collapse leads to intolerant, pissed off people , that then drives the genocide. Consider Germany of the Late 20's - WWII for example.

 

[Woodrow]

Melensdad is exactly right, the LA Riots are fun to mention because they were all over the TV, but they also took place over a very small area. There were no invasions of Malibu or Brentwood. Why? Because the riots were about frustration, and anger within a community. The rioters didn't leave specific areas.

In all of the examples of some sort of social breakdown, the battles were on a tribal level. Yugoslavia was a small collection of many separate ethnic groups--warring tribes with historic grudges crammed into made up borders. Same thing in Rwanda, and the schisms were intensified during colonization.

A ruptured rail car is plausible, that's why we have hotels, as has been pointed out earlier. Don't have money for a hotel or enjoy roughing it a little, go to a campground. Total social economic breakdown in this country is silly.

I honestly can't think of any reason in this country to go charging off into the woods to live. Our society is simply too industrialized, and to do so would serve absolutely no purpose.

 

[Wild Deuce]

Interesting thread. I suppose everyone will prepare according to their perceived need/risk. To each his own.

I lived through several minor hurricanes while in the Carolinas (including the busy year with Fran and Bertha). Having "bug-out" preparations made a world of difference for my family that year. We had the stuff, we had a plan and they "bugged out" to a safer location ... twice.

Having been to Louisiana (not New Orleans) after Katrina, I met more than a few that "bugged out" just before the storm strike. Their preparations allowed them to be comfortable the short time they were away as well as being ahead of the game once they returned.

Again, to each his own.

 

[rjstew317]

When the LA riots occurred they were in a very small area, they did not affect the whole city, most neighborhoods were completely unaffected. Are you saying that if Broadripple goes up in flames you honestly think that Carmel is at a serious level of risk? Seriously?

i'm not sure what bone your trying to pick but their have been many examples in this thread of why it's a good idea to prep, and no one said that you have to. at this point i think your just looking to argue.

 

[melensdad]

i'm not sure what bone your trying to pick but their have been many examples in this thread of why it's a good idea to prep, and no one said that you have to. at this point i think your just looking to argue.

And I agree with prepping. In fact I have lots of preps.

But so much of what is being talked about in this thread has no basis in history based reality.