9mm AR SBR parts

[SavageEagle]

Ok I'll wait to assemble it then. I think above the trigger would be the best place. I really appreciate the help! Maybe one day I'll get this all together and finally get some good pics!

 

[SavageEagle]

I have a couple more questions. I was reading this website I came across about not being able to put a flash suppressor, bayo lug, or collapsable stock on an SBR. This was written 3/04 so I figure this is all been sunset with the AWB. So I'm assuming these are now legal on an SBR? Also with regards to the SBR, I have to have my name and address etc. engraved into it. Is there anything I CAN'T do with it once I register the lower as a SBR?

The website is AR Pistol, SBR, AOW
And this is the excerpt I was concerned with...

The second option you have in regards to an AR-15 pistol is to build a Short Barreled Rifle (SBR) AR-15. Once the lower is registered as a SBR you can then remove the stock and replace it with a pistol buffer and your short 7-inch upper and use it in a PISTOL configuration or keep the stock! With a pre-ban lower you can use it as a pre-ban short barreled rifle including the flash suppressor, bayonet lug, etc. If you use a POST BAN AR-15 and register it as a SBR, you have a number of shortcomings including the fact that you can not use a bayonet lug, flash suppressor, or collapsible stock BUT there is no reason that you can not still use it in a PISTOL configuration! Because this is a SBR and NOT a pistol, the SAW laws do not apply as they would to a post ban Semi Auto Pistol as far as detachable magazine and pistol weight. NOTE: I am confirming these understandings with the ATF!!!

 

[VUPDblue]

Those restrictions sunset with the AWB. You can build it up however you like. As for the engraving, like I have already said, you must engrave your name, city and state. I don't understand what you are asking by "is there anything I can't do with it?" Like what exactly?

 

[SavageEagle]

As far as doing other things with it, I guess I'm asking if it can have a different upper attached at some point? Like going with a 10.5" upper and then going to a 16" upper and back? Or putting a grenade launcher on it? I've also seen some with a shorty shotgun attached or a pistol... I guess I'm asking what are the things that you Can't do to the rifle?

I was thinking about this last night after I went to bed. What happens if I change addresses? Does it have to be re-engraved?

 

[shooter521]

I'm asking if it can have a different upper attached at some point? Like going with a 10.5" upper and then going to a 16" upper and back?

Yes.

Or putting a grenade launcher on it?

Yes, although a grenade launcher (i.e. M203) will be regulated separately as a Destructive Device.

I've also seen some with a shorty shotgun attached or a pistol...

Attaching a short-barreled AOW (i.e. Serbu) to a rifle would result in the creation of a Short-Barreled Shotgun, since the AOW would be using the rifle's stock while attached. SBS are a no-go in Indiana. I suppose you could rig up something similar using an 18" barreled pistol-gripped shotgun like a Mossberg 500 Cruiser, but the shotgun would be WAY longer than the rifle.

Similarly, attaching a pistol to a rifle would require the pistol to be registered as an SBR, since it would be using the rifle's stock while attached.

I guess I'm asking what are the things that you Can't do to the rifle?

1) Drill the lower for an auto-sear
2) Take it across state lines without an approved ATF F 5320.20
3) Install the short (<16") upper on a non-registered lower, even temporarily

What happens if I change addresses? Does it have to be re-engraved?

No, but you must inform ATF in writing of your address change.

 

[SavageEagle]

So in effect if I attach a pistol to the SBR, the pistol itself becomes an SBR and must be registered also? So that would mean the engraving and all that for the pistol aswell?

Also, if you mount a shotgun to a normal AR, does the rifle then become an AOW or DD? Or does the Shotgun? Or both?

What's funny is that SBS are no-go's here but you can have a full auto AK or M16 or UZI or Chain Gun or whatever. What were these idiots thinking... Oh wait, N/M...

 

[Don]

Any pistol attacked to any kind of a buttstock be it a glock attached to a sbr ar with one of them goofy mounts or to a 20" infantry ar15, the pistol is attached to a buttstock and becomes a SBR.

If you put a shotgun under your ar and its a AOW (like a serbu super shorty) It then will become a illegal SBS.

 

[shooter521]

the pistol itself becomes an SBR and must be registered also? So that would mean the engraving and all that for the pistol aswell?

Yes, I thought my original reply was fairly clear?

Also, if you mount a shotgun to a normal AR, does the rifle then become an AOW or DD? Or does the Shotgun? Or both?

Assuming you're also talking a "normal" shotgun (i.e. non-SBS, non-AOW), then nothing happens. You have simply attached a shotgun to a rifle, with each still falling under its respective federal definition. Example would be an 18" Rem 870 or Mossy 500 action mounted under a 16" M4 in a "Masterkey" type setup.

That's just my reasonably well-informed opinion, of course. This is not legal advice, IANAL, and I've been wrong before...

 

[SavageEagle]

Any pistol attacked to any kind of a buttstock be it a glock attached to a sbr ar with one of them goofy mounts or to a 20" infantry ar15, the pistol is attached to a buttstock and becomes a SBR.

If you put a shotgun under your ar and its a AOW (like a serbu super shorty) It then will become a illegal SBS.

Yes, I thought my original reply was fairly clear?

Assuming you're also talking a "normal" shotgun (i.e. non-SBS, non-AOW), then nothing happens. You have simply attached a shotgun to a rifle, with each still falling under its respective federal definition. Example would be an 18" Rem 870 or Mossy 500 action mounted under a 16" M4 in a "Masterkey" type setup.

That's just my reasonably well-informed opinion, of course. This is not legal advice, IANAL, and I've been wrong before...

Ok I just wanted to be really clear on this. I was considering a quick detatch mount for a pistol on my rifle so I wouldn't have to Drop-draw-aim. More like detatch-drop-aim. May not be faster but it was just a thought. I was hoping that i wouldn't have to register the pistol since it wouldn't be a permanent fixture of the rifle. I may not go with this but I appreciate the info.

I think the Shogun attatched to a rifle would be pretty cool. You could have a door breacher and a CQB rifle all in one but since SBS are a no no I definately won't be going this route. It's just so STUPID that you can't have a SBS. I'll never understand their logic. Oh well. I can't wait to get this all put together!

Thanks guys!

 

[VUPDblue]

The masterkey setup is only cool (or useful) in theory...

 

[SavageEagle]

Yea... but you gotta admit, the guy that breaks into your house staring down a 5.56 barrel AND a 12ga barrel must be crapping his pants...

 

[shooter521]

The masterkey setup is only cool (or useful) in theory...

Hey, it rocked in "Predator"!

C-More's M26 MASS has potential for guys whose job description includes both carrying an M4 and breaching doors... but we'll never get to have 'em.

M26 Modular Accessory Shotgun System

 

[ashylarry]

a shotgun attached to a SBR sounds pretty stupid. Just use one or the other. Just more to go wrong.

 

[SavageEagle]

I think a Serbu attached to a SBR would be pretty awesome myself. Load it up with salt loads in the Serbu and hot lead in the 5.56 and you have your choice of less-than-lethal or lethal. Again, it was just a thought. I'm still focused on this whole SBR process.

 

[ashylarry]

Yah I understand. But how were you planning to attach the two?

 

[SavageEagle]

IDK. It was just a thought. I've seen pistol attachments that lock the pistol onto the rail. You can't fire it from the rail but it acts as a forward grip for the rifle. IDK about the shotgun though. It would be sorta pointless unless it was an autoloader IMO.

 

[bigcraig]

This thread has gone WAY off topic, but increased in its hilarity.

 

[bwframe]

This thread has gone WAY off topic, but increased in its hilarity.

Hey, I'm thinking of taking a construction helmet and mounting two Serbu's on the sides and an SBR on the top. Maybe rigging a tongue trigger to it all?

 

[SavageEagle]

hope you have some good ear plugs!

 

[JosephR]

You CAN purchase a short barreled upper before you get your form approved. You might only want to do this if you find a great deal on a used one or perhaps ADCO or someone has a sale on the items you want. What you would do in this case, is simply store it at a friend's house or your parent's house- just somewhere noone has access to a rifle lower.

You can always buy said stripped lower and have it sold as a "pistol" when you fill out the 4473. Don't ever put a stock on it though until you get your paperwork back. That will allow you to keep the short upper at your residence without worrying about constructive intent.

I second or third the suggestions to buy from Steve at ADCO. He's sold me numerous items in the past. I think I've spent a few k with him. He's always helped me out and even helped solve problems I've had with friends' rifles. He even sold me the G5 he "abused" to prove that they don't fail as quickly as Robert and AAC made one fail. It works well and I got a helluva deal on it!