Why Obama is going to get 4 more years.

[churchmouse]

And a vote for someone who would have no allies in the government that would work with them will assure the same outcome.

^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^

A third party President would be near useless to effect any real change. The system is what it is and without cleaning house (Bureaucrats too) we are not going to get anywhere I fear.

 

[hornadylnl]

And a vote for someone who would have no allies in the government that would work with them will assure the same outcome.

So senate and house republicans will put their hatred for Paul above the good of the country? They're going to vote against the repeal of laws and spending cuts?

Can I vote for these heros twice?

 

[hornadylnl]

^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^

A third party President would be near useless to effect any real change. The system is what it is and without cleaning house (Bureaucrats too) we are not going to get anywhere I fear.

How do we clean Washington of bureaucrats if we only vote for the bureaucrat party?

 

[churchmouse]

How in the world do you figure that? Paul is going to be in the primary. Obama won't be. Paul will not be running in the general in November, against Obama. A vote for Paul in the primaries will have no say in the outcome of the general. This is a truly ridiculous assertion.

Hold your hat down there Hot Rod......I was talking about all who have alluded to a write in vote. I hear and read this everyday. I am going to make a point is the argument. That is ridiculous. I was by no means trying to get your hair up.

 

[churchmouse]

How do we clean Washington of bureaucrats if we only vote for the bureaucrat party?

Good point. That should be what we are discussing. I have no real answer for the obvious solution. How do we get there from here.

 

[firehawk1]

So senate and house republicans will put their hatred for Paul above the good of the country?

Hatred for Paul maybe an overstatement. As I have said many times, for right or wrong Paul has been labeled a kook, extremest. Anyone wishing to be reelected would distance themselves from such a person. Politics man, politics.

 

[canav844]

And a vote for someone who would have no allies in the government that would work with them will assure the same outcome.

I didn't realize there were NO house or senate seat races in the next election.

You get what you elect and it only takes 6 years to change everybody in office out if you have enough people on board.

 

[Stschil]

Hatred for Paul maybe an overstatement. As I have said many times, for right or wrong Paul has been labeled a kook, extremest. Anyone wishing to be reelected would distance themselves from such a person. [STRIKE]Politics man, politics[/STRIKE] Status Quo man, Status Quo.

FIFY

I've said more times that I can count, focus energies on getting the right people in Congress and forget the bickering about POTUS. However, a strong POTUS might just remind some of those bench sitters in Congress exactly what they were elected to do. Unfortunately, the current crop of candidates, Paul included, don't have that in them.

 

[hornadylnl]

Hatred for Paul maybe an overstatement. As I have said many times, for right or wrong Paul has been labeled a kook, extremest. Anyone wishing to be reelected would distance themselves from such a person. Politics man, politics.

So you're trying to fix a broken system with broken tools that can't possibly get the job done and us third party voters are the losers?

 

[firehawk1]

I didn't realize there were NO house or senate seat races in the next election.

You get what you elect and it only takes 6 years to change everybody in office out if you have enough people on board.

And can anyone produce a list of candidates in sufficient numbers that agree with Paul to make up a majority on both houses of Congress AND be elected at the same time? THAT is what is required for Paul to be successful. Personally I find that about as remote as anything could be. I refuse to deal in wishful thinking, and try to remain firmly grounded in reality.

 

[hornadylnl]

And can anyone produce a list of candidates in sufficient numbers that agree with Paul to make up a majority on both houses of Congress AND be elected at the same time? THAT is what is required for Paul to be successful. Personally I find that about as remote as anything could be. I refuse to deal in wishful thinking, and try to remain firmly grounded in reality.

Isn't the hope of voting out Obama to save this country wishful thinking?

 

[churchmouse]

Isn't the hope of voting out Obama to save this country wishful thinking?

God I hope it isn't but you may be right.

 

[firehawk1]

So you're trying to fix a broken system with broken tools that can't possibly get the job done and us third party voters are the losers?

No, stop painting yourself as a third party voter as the "victims". We ALL are victims in this mess. If I have the chance to vote for,

1. Someone who has ZERO chance of being elected because the numbers are not there, and voting for them has no meaning other than a protest vote. (Which by the way NO ONE in government cares about protest voters.)

2. Someone who is not what I really want, but is preferable over the incumbent.

3. Someone who has a PROVEN socialist/marxist type record.

I'll choose #2 any day of the week. But then you know that as we have discussed this many times.

 

[firehawk1]

Isn't the hope of voting out Obama to save this country wishful thinking?

It is no more or less of a start than voting for Paul or Johnson IMO.

 

[hornadylnl]

No, stop painting yourself as a third party voter as the "victims". We ALL are victims in this mess. If I have the chance to vote for,

1. Someone who has ZERO chance of being elected because the numbers are not there, and voting for them has no meaning other than a protest vote. (Which by the way NO ONE in government cares about protest voters.)

2. Someone who is not what I really want, but is preferable over the incumbent.

3. Someone who has a PROVEN socialist/marxist type record.

I'll choose #2 any day of the week. But then you know that as we have discussed this many times.

I'm not a victim. I'm just not chasing a fool's errand by playing a game that can't possibly be won.

So Obama loses this November. A few house and senate seats change hands. Romney steps into the white and 4-8 years later, government is bigger than the day he arrived and his voters are either silent or makes excuses for it. The people get fed up and he's replaced by the next democrat. Wash, rinse, repeat. What exactly is accomplished here?

 

[churchmouse]

I'm not a victim. I'm just not chasing a fool's errand by playing a game that can't possibly be won.

So Obama loses this November. A few house and senate seats change hands. Romney steps into the white and 4-8 years later, government is bigger than the day he arrived and his voters are either silent or makes excuses for it. The people get fed up and he's replaced by the next democrat. Wash, rinse, repeat. What exactly is accomplished here?

Politics as usual, nothing more, nothing less.
We will never shrink the size of Gov. with out a revolution. And in the words of the Who, Hail to the new boss, same as the old boss. History is exactly what you describe, wash, rinse, repeat.

 

[firehawk1]

I'm not a victim. I'm just not chasing a fool's errand by playing a game that can't possibly be won.

So Obama loses this November. A few house and senate seats change hands. Romney steps into the white and 4-8 years later, government is bigger than the day he arrived and his voters are either silent or makes excuses for it. The people get fed up and he's replaced by the next democrat. Wash, rinse, repeat. What exactly is accomplished here?

And exactly what will be accomplished with a Paul or Johnson administration WITH a Congress that would refuse to work with them? I say, wash, rinse, repeat only with a different detergent.

 

[hornadylnl]

And exactly what will be accomplished with a Paul or Johnson administration WITH a Congress that would refuse to work with them? I say, wash, rinse, repeat only with a different detergent.

How do you fix a party when you keep buying their product, regardless of how bad it is? How does a party giving a flying **** what you want or think when they know they can count on your vote EVERY SINGLE ELECTION?

I know a third party won't work either because there are too many people in love with the status quo. But if we ever hope to change the platform of either party, a significant number of people are going to have to vote for a third party or none of the above.

A restaurant will never fire a terrible chef if every seat in the dining room is full.

 

[hornadylnl]

I'm going to donate $1 to the UN and proclaim that I helped solve world hunger. That's about as effective as voting R or D is.

 

[Roscoe38]

As I understand, or not understand, the Libertarian solution to saving this great nation is a smaller government.

* How many people are employed by the IRS
* How many people are employed by the Department of Defense
* How many people are employed by the Social Security Administration

If these people are put out of work and are allowed to draw unemployment compensation, from where does the money come to pay this bill?

* How many AMERICAN auto workers are employed by the BIG THREE

Would you have all Government Employees drawing unemployment benefits?

We need people in The big houses of Congress and Senate who will write, pass, and overturn the inevitable veto of legislation that will get private enterprise going again.

Maybe even make it impossible for Corporate America to produce products in Mexico and other South American countries and sell them here in the United States without paying staggering tariffs; as do the countries with markets that of which we are locked out. Maybe.....