What is worse: DPMS or Hi-Point?

[melensdad]

Seriously, WTF is wrong with DPMS and their absolute lack of quality controls? Do they intentionally ship crap just to fill orders.

I've had DPMS parts that simply didn't fit unless they were ground down on a grinder. So I stopped using them and learned my lessons.

A buddy of mine said he had to beat into place a bolt release because it didn't fit and now it doesn't freely move like its supposed to (well doh! he obviously needed to grind or smooth something down instead of beating it into place). Triggers feel like grit over sandpaper too. Even the color of the anodizing is uneven on a lot of the ones I've handled.

Seriously, for $150 you can walk into a gun shop and get a Hi-Point pistol. For about $200 you can get a carbine. The guns work. They are ugly as your sister-in-law but the darn things make bullets fly out of the barrel when you pull the trigger.

I've sworn off the crap from DPMS but the stories of crummy quality keep popping up.

So seriously what is worse? DPMS or Hi-Point

 

[Crystalship1]

Seriously, WTF is wrong with DPMS and their absolute lack of quality controls? Do they intentionally ship crap just to fill orders.

I've had DPMS parts that simply didn't fit unless they were ground down on a grinder. So I stopped using them and learned my lessons.

A buddy of mine said he had to beat into place a bolt release because it didn't fit and now it doesn't freely move like its supposed to (well doh! he obviously needed to grind or smooth something down instead of beating it into place). Triggers feel like grit over sandpaper too. Even the color of the anodizing is uneven on a lot of the ones I've handled.

Seriously, for $150 you can walk into a gun shop and get a Hi-Point pistol. For about $200 you can get a carbine. The guns work. They are ugly as your sister-in-law but the darn things make bullets fly out of the barrel when you pull the trigger.

I've sworn off the crap from DPMS but the stories of crummy quality keep popping up.

So seriously what is worse? DPMS or Hi-Point

By your own definition..... Since Hi-Points do what they are designed to do...... I'd have to say DPMS. But I'm taking your word on the DPMS issues as I have no personal knowledge.

 

[melensdad]

I'd have to say DPMS. But I'm taking your word on the DPMS issues

There was a thread with some complaints about DPMS LPKs being crap a while back.

Several people responded saying their quality control was lacking.

I just happened to handle the rifle with the pounded in part and it got me a bit ticked off about the junk that I see people pay good money for. The part can be fixed, I'll take his rifle apart, grind it down and put it back together. But still WTF? And I did call him an idiot for doing that!!!

 

[csaws]

I bought two DPMS lpk's from slow1911's and they fit great, no issues whatsoever with trigger feeling like it had sand in it. Eventually everyone has crap come out of the factory.

 

[dman65]

DPMS

I have used DPMS on the last 3 build's I have done with no problems. fit and finish were perfect

 

[mospeada]

I recently bought a DPMS rifle and it seems to work just fine. The trigger isn't anything to write home about, but I've not felt too many mass produced anythings with really good triggers.

 

[GJ1981]

I've only had experience with a DPMS parts kit for my Colt and I was not happy. Like you mentioned most of the parts either didn't fit or had to be modified to fit. A friend of my had the same problems with the kit for his Bushmaster. I have no experience with the HP so I have no idea on which is worse.

 

[shooter521]

As far as complete rifles go, I've seen way more problems with Olympic than with DPMS. Further, I have used DPMS LPKs and lower receivers in several builds with no fit or function problems. Of course, I've also had a CMT/Stag LPK that absolutely sucked. Most folks swear by them, and the other Stag LPKs I've used before and since have been fine.

Every manufacturer puts out crap once in awhile; it is 1) the frequency with which it happens and 2) how the mfr. deals with it that makes the difference.

 

[melensdad]

As far as complete rifles go, I've seen way more problems with. . .

Ah, but how does DPMS compare to a Hi-Point carbine? That is the question!!!

I recently bought a DPMS rifle and it seems to work just fine. The trigger isn't anything to write home about, but I've not felt too many mass produced anythings with really good triggers.

Just curious, but do you have anything to compare it to? As a stand alone, with no comparison or frame of reference, it would probably be hard to be critical of DPMS. Same with Hi-Point. Set either one next to a custom anything and quality differences become glaring. Set either the DPMS or the Hi-Point next to a bottom of the barrel production gun and you may have to search around for quality differences. Just a thought.

I've only had experience with a DPMS parts kit for my Colt and I was not happy. Like you mentioned most of the parts either didn't fit or had to be modified to fit. A friend of my had the same problems with the kit for his Bushmaster. I have no experience with the HP so I have no idea on which is worse.

And that is my experience and those of some friends. Compared to some other brands the DPMS stuff seems to be just a shade better than scrap metal. My frame of reference includes 6 other brands and I've completely given up on ANYTHING that comes from DPMS.

I was seriously considering a Remington R-25 in 308 but its my understanding that DPMS builds those for Remington. If I can confirm that then I'll take a wide pass on the Remington R-25. It is also my understanding that the Reminton R-15 is made by Bushmaster, so those should be OK. Bushy may not be the best, but it is reasonably well made and the parts are pretty good, so if they build the R-15 for Remington then that rifle should be decent.

 

[BloodEclipse]

DPMS Lower not the parts kit with a detent spring hole not tapped deep enough. I had to cut 1 turn out of the spring on the parts kit. I measured both springs and they were fine. I will stick to Stag lowers.

 

[mospeada]

Just curious, but do you have anything to compare it to? As a stand alone, with no comparison or frame of reference, it would probably be hard to be critical of DPMS. Same with Hi-Point. Set either one next to a custom anything and quality differences become glaring. Set either the DPMS or the Hi-Point next to a bottom of the barrel production gun and you may have to search around for quality differences. Just a thought.

I don't own another AR15 if that's what you're getting at. I don't think that is a requirement for evaluating a firearm. My DPMS is properly assembled (correct stakings and all) and functions flawlessly, as I said, the trigger isn't the best, but it is a mass produced gun and I've not run accross ANY mass produced gun with a great trigger.

If you want to rail against DPMS and trash them, then so be it, but don't tell me I can't evaluate whether an example in my possession is or is not a properly functioning, well assembled rifle. It is not, nor did I claim that it is a custom class rifle. That in my mind wasn't the discussion.

In essence, I guess I shouldn't have replied to your question as your question was whether Hi-Point or DPMS are better and as I don't and will not own a Hi-Point, I'm unqualified to answer. Please excuse my ignorance, I'll remove myself from this discussion.

 

[shooter521]

Ah, but how does DPMS compare to a Hi-Point carbine? That is the question!!!

Incidence of problems with either brand has been very low, IME. Hi-Point Carbines are crudely built and uglier than sin, but functional. DPMS rifles are better put together and at least a little prettier, and also functional. So I guess the edge would have to go to DPMS?

 

[Turtle]

No exp with the DPMS.... but hi-points are good long as you only use brass ammo. That steal cased stuff used to jam in the one i bought 5 or so years ago.... sold it for 50$ 4 years ago... and bought a sigma 40.

From what Ive hear and read both guns are crap the high point is just more reliable crap that actually works....

 

[Sailor]

A friends HP C9 fell apart after 600 rnds, broken slide retaining pin or something.

I would buy 2 so, while one is at the factory getting fixed you can use the other. Thats the only first hand knowledge I have of them.

Not for me.

 

[cosermann]

No problems with DPMS in my experience. I would expect the % of all things AR going out the door right now with a defect would be a little higher than normal due to the 500% or so increase in demand for those things. As long as a vendor, makes it right, I'm fine with it.

 

[melensdad]

. . . but don't tell me I can't evaluate whether an example in my possession . . .

I never did that. Nor did I imply it. Please read, carefully, what I wrote. It was a simple question.[/quote]

My DPMS is properly assembled (correct stakings and all)

Not according to the charts of such things. This chart, while I am a critic of it, is often used to show if a gun is correctly assembled per mil-spec standards: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA&hl=en

. . . I would expect the % of all things AR going out the door right now with a defect would be a little higher than normal due to the 500% or so increase in demand for those things. . .

All of the ill fitting stuff is "pre-Obama" none was purchased near or post election.

But based on your observation I'd hate to see the stuff that was rushed through production.

 

[chipdog4]

I was seriously considering a Remington R-25 in 308 but its my understanding that DPMS builds those for Remington. If I can confirm that then I'll take a wide pass on the Remington R-25. It is also my understanding that the Reminton R-15 is made by Bushmaster, so those should be OK. Bushy may not be the best, but it is reasonably well made and the parts are pretty good, so if they build the R-15 for Remington then that rifle should be decent.

Quoted from the DPMS rep on arfcom.

The R-25 is manufactured by DPMS and the R-15 is manufactured by Bushmaster...

 

[rhino]

Obvious axe-grinding is never pretty, nor is it exceptionally helpful to anyone else.

 

[Crystalship1]

A friends HP C9 fell apart after 600 rnds, broken slide retaining pin or something.

I would buy 2 so, while one is at the factory getting fixed you can use the other. Thats the only first hand knowledge I have of them.

Not for me.

First.. that's second hand knowledge, as it would had to of happened to you to be first hand.

Second... H/P has a "no questions asked" unlimited lifetime warranty up to and including total replacement!!

Third...... There was a fella on a H/P forum just a few months ago that went over 20K rounds in his H/P C9 before having it die. He sent it into H/P and they rebuilt and threw-in several free magazines so he could start all over again.

H/P's are (as stated here) ugly, clunky, and AWESOME!!!!

 

[Sailor]

First.. that's second hand knowledge, as it would had to of happened to you to be first hand.

Second... H/P has a "no questions asked" unlimited lifetime warranty up to and including total replacement!!

Third...... There was a fella on a H/P forum just a few months ago that went over 20K rounds in his H/P C9 before having it die. He sent it into H/P and they rebuilt and threw-in several free magazines so he could start all over again.

H/P's are (as stated here) ugly, clunky, and AWESOME!!!!

You are right I did not see it fail in person. Just messed with it after the fact so I can not verify it failed due to him firing it.

I know they have a great warranty, but the warranty wont put holes in a bad guy while the gun is in the mail.