Tell Me Again How Awful HOA’s Are?

[BE Mike]

I've lived with a HOA for 22 years. The HOA Facebook page is a valuable tool to resolve issues and keep up with criminal activity in the neighborhood. The rules have been reasonable and nobody seems to wait with bated breath to jump when a rule is violated. One member of the board is a little bit too enthusiastic about how wonderful the HOA is, but he is a new member. The fee is $150.00 per year. One thing that the HOA can't stop is those folks who persistently speed through the neighborhood, ignore stop signs, etc. That and those who have motorcycles without mufflers who feel the need for attention and "rap" the throttle regularly. Oddly enough, it seems like the vast majority of people who exhibit these behaviors are full grown adults, not teens.

 

[jkaetz]

Yes it does, apparently the freedom to enter into agreements with other property owners is not a freedom INGO recognizes…

That's because it's not freedom. You have to take everything or nothing on sometimes very complex sets of rules. Freedom would be actually being able to negotiate points of disagreement when you buy in just as you can with other contracts.

 

[jamil]

But your avatar says "Freedom"...

A reasonable agreement on how people densely packed into a subdivision or condo complex should live is within “freedom” as with freedom comes responsibly. Consequences for beeing irresponsible is reasonable in a free society.

I mean, imagine your home is on 1/5 acre lot, in a subdivision with 500 homes. Your neighbor is Joe Biden. He likes to have sheep around so he has them grazing on his land. And from time to time you have to put up with Hunter Biden ****ing the sheep. You’d want an agreement between all the neighbors that you’ll not be subject to these kinds of things.

That agreement wouldn’t have to be an HOA. It could be zoning ordinances that would disallow sheep herding. And the community decency laws would cover the sheep ****ing.

 

[Hoosierdood]

That's because it's not freedom. You have to take everything or nothing on sometimes very complex sets of rules. Freedom would be actually being able to negotiate points of disagreement when you buy in just as you can with other contracts.

Netflix and Amazon don’t let me negotiate. Freedom hating bastages!

 

[jkaetz]

Netflix and Amazon don’t let me negotiate. Freedom hating bastages!

I see nothing false in this statement. I also don't see a connection to HOAs.

 

[eldirector]

I see nothing false in this statement. I also don't see a connection to HOAs.

Netflix has a contract. HOAs have a contract. Neither let you negotiate individuals points on the contract. It is all or none.

I suspect most folks don't read either contract.

 

[Ingomike]

Oddly enough, it seems like the vast majority of people who exhibit these behaviors are full grown adults, not teens.

It seems odd but happens so often…

 

[Ingomike]

That's because it's not freedom. You have to take everything or nothing on sometimes very complex sets of rules. Freedom would be actually being able to negotiate points of disagreement when you buy in just as you can with other contracts.

You are forgetting the owner has the complete freedom to put whatever covenants they wish on a property and make them non-negotiable. That the seller does not want to negotiate them is not taking anyones freedom. The buyer has complete freedom not to accept those covenants. No one’s freedoms are being taken? It is all a perception that someone is taking freedom from someone...

 

[Ingomike]

I suspect most folks don't read either contract.

This happens so often. Owners fail to do what he purchase agreement stipulates, and send the buyer the most current covenants and bylaws.

 

[BugI02]

Yes it does, apparently the freedom to enter into agreements with other property owners is not a freedom INGO recognizes…

It is because it isn't really voluntary, if you want to live there you have to become a citizen of the crown

 

[BugI02]

I've lived with a HOA for 22 years. The HOA Facebook page is a valuable tool to resolve issues and keep up with criminal activity in the neighborhood. The rules have been reasonable and nobody seems to wait with bated breath to jump when a rule is violated. One member of the board is a little bit too enthusiastic about how wonderful the HOA is, but he is a new member. The fee is $150.00 per year. One thing that the HOA can't stop is those folks who persistently speed through the neighborhood, ignore stop signs, etc. That and those who have motorcycles without mufflers who feel the need for attention and "rap" the throttle regularly. Oddly enough, it seems like the vast majority of people who exhibit these behaviors are full grown adults, not teens.

From reading in this thread, it seems like you could just add spike strips and mandatory mufflers to the bylaws. It appears that there are no functional limits on how much freedom the HOA can require you to sacrifice ex post facto

 

[BugI02]

Netflix has a contract. HOAs have a contract. Neither let you negotiate individuals points on the contract. It is all or none.

I suspect most folks don't read either contract.

But if Netflix changes their terms, you can opt out by dropping the service for a different one

Netflix doesn't force you to sell your TV and computer if you want out

 

[Ingomike]

It is because it isn't really voluntary, if you want to live there you have to become a citizen of the crown

You guys crack me up…

Fun thread though…

 

[actaeon277]

That's not exactly a rebuttal

 

[actaeon277]

That's not exactly a rebuttal

 

[Hoosierdood]

But if Netflix changes their terms, you can opt out by dropping the service for a different one

Netflix doesn't force you to sell your TV and computer if you want out

Sure it’s freedom. You have the freedom to choose. You can choose to live within a HOA or not. If you choose to live within a HOA, then you also choose to live by their rules, which can change at any time. You made the choice when you signed that contract.

If at any time you don’t like their rules, you can choose to sell that property and go elsewhere. Nobody is forcing you to move or stay.

The freedom to choose does not negate the consequences of your choice.

 

[actaeon277]

Sure it’s freedom. You have the freedom to choose. You can choose to live within a HOA or not. If you choose to live within a HOA, then you also choose to live by their rules, which can change at any time. You made the choice when you signed that contract.

If at any time you don’t like their rules, you can choose to sell that property and go elsewhere. Nobody is forcing you to move or stay.

The freedom to choose does not negate the consequences of your choice.

Can you choose?
Sounds like a lot of cities have a lot of them?

 

[actaeon277]

And if you join one, and they start popping off new rules, you CAN'T opt out.

 

[actaeon277]

At least if I have to deal with Code Enforcement, Courts are available.

 

[Hoosierdood]

And if you join one, and they start popping off new rules, you CAN'T opt out.

This is 100% accurate. But the homeowner agreed to those conditions when they signed the contract. It is not a violation of rights when you voluntarily give those rights up.