SB 577 To Cut Veteran's Benefits in IN.

[Sailor]

Not sure if this has been posted.

But basically it takes College money from disabled vets kids and uses it to pay for the education of convicted felons in prison.

Call your reps.

senator.kenley@iga.in.gov is the behind this.




DIGEST OF SB 577 (Updated February 7, 2011 4:58 pm - DI 73)



Citations Affected: IC 11-10; IC 21-12; IC 21-13; IC 21-14.

Synopsis: Financial aid. Allows the department of correction to provide financial assistance for tuition, books, and supplies for an incarcerated felony offender who enrolls in a college degree program, and prohibits the state student assistance commission from providing the financial assistance. Specifies that individuals who have an associate degree are eligible for the same awards as a student who graduated from high school with a core 40 or academic honors diploma. Provides that the commission for higher education (CHE) shall maintain the records of students attending an approved postsecondary educational institution under a higher education award. Requires an approved postsecondary educational institution to provide to the CHE the student data that is requested by the CHE and that is necessary to carry out the higher education award provisions. Requires a student participating in the twenty-first century scholarship program to: (1) participate in an appropriate intervention program while enrolled in secondary school; and (2) maintain a grade point average of 2.5 during grades 9, 10, 11, and 12, if the student enters the twenty-first century scholarship program after the 2010-2011 school year. Provides

(Continued next page)


Effective: Upon passage; July 1, 2011.


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Kenley

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January 20, 2011, read first time and referred to Committee on Appropriations.
February 3, 2011, amended, reported favorably _ Do Pass.
February 7, 2011, read second time, amended, ordered engrossed.


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Digest Continued

that a twenty-first century scholarship may not be renewed unless the student has participated in appropriate intervention programs while attending the eligible postsecondary educational institution. Allows money to be transferred from the freedom of choice grant fund to the higher education award fund. Reduces the amount of the educational scholarship provided to a child of a parent with a military service related disability of less than 80% for an eligible applicant who is enrolled in a state educational institution. Provides that the scholarship reduction does not apply to a student who is enrolled in a state educational institution as of June 30, 2011, to a student who was a pupil at the Soldiers' and Sailors' Children's Home, or to a student whose parent received a Purple Heart decoration or was wounded in enemy action. Provides that only undergraduate fees are eligible for remission or scholarship awards.
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[CVMA544]

Taking money from disabled vets kids for convicts, guess the moral of this story is crime pays, service doesn't.

 

[E5RANGER375]

 

[CVMA544]

MY email to that POS

Crime pays, service doesn't is the message I get from this.

As the conservative that I am, I stepped up twice and was sent to war for this country in two wars. (Once as an IRR member the other as a National Guard member)

I see you graduated law school in 72 which is what three years?

But yet you list US ARMY from 69-71.

How did you find time to go to law school and serve in the US ARMY at the same time?

Or where you one of them fellows that joined National Guard or Reserve and went to college instead of Vietnam and now want to tout your service like you were active duty to impress people with your "Veteran" status?

And if by chance you are a Vietnam Vet then you should know that you can have a greatly diminished earning capability in civilian life from service connected disabilities far less than the 80% standard you applied to SB577.

If you think I am taking this a little personal, yeah I am.

I am 100% disabled from combat related injuries during my tour in Iraq.

My son has two tours in Iraq.

My daughter has one tour in Iraq.

My ex son in law and Grandsons father has two tours in Iraq, one of which he served with me.

My second Grandson's father was KIA in Iraq on his second tour.

SO why are convicts so much more important than Veterans kids?

You know there is a far greater probability that those Veterans kids will go on to serve in the military than any of those felons who for whatever reason decided to break the law and become a burden to the society the Disabled Veterans chose to defend.

I don't expect a reply, don't bother, there is no way you can justify SB577 I don't care what you say.

 

[jedi]

OP your title it not quite true. It's not cutting a veteran's benfits but the CHILD of a veteran. It would reduce the scholarship amount to a child of a 80% or less disabled vet. Not sure if this reduction is then going to pay for the inmate not not. See red below. Next tme please read the text fiully before jumping to conclusions. Now with that said I'm not likey the reduction to the child of the vet. From the looks of it they want to shift the burdern of financial aid for inmates from the state student assistance commisssion to the dept. of correction. If so that may be a good thing since it means that the "education" money for inmates would be in the dept. of correction budget which could be lowered and/or cut. Not sure.

Depends are they going to INCREASE the dept. of correction budget? Are they going to decrease the state student assistance commisssion budget by the INCERASE in the other?

Need more info!!!!


Indiana General Assembly


See items in read.
Financial aid. Allows the department of correction to provide financial assistance for tuition, books, and supplies for an incarcerated felony offender who enrolls in a college degree program, and prohibits the state student assistance commission from providing the financial assistance. Specifies that individuals who have an associate degree are eligible for the same awards as a student who graduated from high school with a core 40 or academic honors diploma. Provides that the commission for higher education (CHE) shall maintain the records of students attending an approved postsecondary educational institution under a higher education award. Requires an approved postsecondary educational institution to provide to the CHE the student data that is requested by the CHE and that is necessary to carry out the higher education award provisions. Requires a student participating in the twenty-first century scholarship program to: (1) participate in an appropriate intervention program while enrolled in secondary school; and (2) maintain a grade point average of 2.5 during grades 9, 10, 11, and 12, if the student enters the twenty-first century scholarship program after the 2010-2011 school year. Provides that a twenty-first century scholarship may not be renewed unless the student has participated in appropriate intervention programs while attending the eligible postsecondary educational institution. Allows money to be transferred from the freedom of choice grant fund to the higher education award fund. Reduces the amount of the educational scholarship provided to a child of a parent with a military service related disability of less than 80% for an eligible applicant who is enrolled in a state educational institution. Provides that the scholarship reduction does not apply to a student who is enrolled in a state educational institution as of June 30, 2011, to a student who was a pupil at the Soldiers' and Sailors' Children's Home, or to a student whose parent received a Purple Heart decoration or was wounded in enemy action. Provides that only undergraduate fees are eligible for remission or scholarship awards.

 

[jedi]

BTW the child's reduction is as follows:

(c) This subsection applies to an individual who qualifies as an eligible applicant under section 1(3) of this chapter because the individual's father or mother suffered a disability as determined by the United States Department of Veterans Affairs. This subsection does not apply to an individual who is an eligible applicant under section 1(3) of this chapter and who as of June 30, 2011, is enrolled in a state educational institution, or to an individual who also qualifies as an eligible applicant under section 1(1) or 1(2) of this chapter. Subject to subsection (b), the eligible applicant is entitled to a reduction in the educational costs that would otherwise apply as follows:
(1) If the individual's father or mother suffered a disability as determined by the United States Department of Veterans Affairs with a rating of eighty percent (80%) or more, the individual is entitled to a one hundred percent (100%) reduction in education costs.
(2) If the individual's father or mother suffered a disability as determined by the United States Department of Veterans Affairs with a rating of less than eighty percent (80%), the individual is entitled to a reduction in education costs equal to the sum of:
(A) twenty percent (20%); plus
(B) the disability rating of the individual's father or mother.


per
Senate Bill 0577

Again my questions are in terms of the budget. How much is the DOC going to get for the finacial aid? How much is the "student aid fund" going to lose due to this?

 

[Sailor]

You are right I should have read it fully, I acted on emotion. It just hurts my brain to read legaleze. It appears the bill give .gov to right to transfer funds between the two?

 

[E5RANGER375]

ok but isnt it comforting to know that if the unthinkable happens and you can no longer work to give your kids an education, that it is taken care of? so in my opinion this does effect vets.

 

[jedi]

ok but isnt it comforting to know that if the unthinkable happens and you can no longer work to give your kids an education, that it is taken care of? so in my opinion this does effect vets.

Hu? I'm not sure what the CURRENT law says in terms of children of disabled vets. (CoDV). I think right now CoDV get 100% assistance. Whereas with this new law it will be from 100% all the way down to 20% depending on the % of disablity on the vet.

The bigger question and now that is NOT answered in this bill is how is the money going to be divided. Right now both the CoDV and the prisoner "fight" for the same pool of money for tutition help since it comes from a single fund. With this bill it looks like they won't be "fighting" for the same money since it will come from 2 different funds.

However the CoDV (some) will be affected since they may get less assistance since it depends on mom/dad's dib %. I'm Ok with 100% dib vet child getting 100% assiatnce. Not sure about those vets that are say 50% dib. Should child get 100% or 70% (20% + % of dib vet)?

That one I'm not sure on guess it depends on cost.

 

[E5RANGER375]

i think they should all get 100% bennefits. thats what im saying.

also, im not for giving criminals anything except 4 walls and 1 meal a day.

for some, going to prison is more of an incentive than staying out.

 

[jedi]

i think they should all get 100% bennefits. thats what im saying.

also, im not for giving criminals anything except 4 walls and 1 meal a day.

for some, going to prison is more of an incentive than staying out.

Agree on the criminals. On the kids of veterans not sure. It was the veteran and NOT the kids that served. This one is a hard 1 for me but I think the sliding scale I am okay with. As a 20% vet is "better off" than a 100% vet who cannot work and/or provide for his family at all.

 

[LPMan59]

veterans, especially disabled and KIA, and their families are one of the few groups of people i support the government providing benefits to.

the whole system is FUBAR. I had a child who's TriCare was terminated while his dad was on active duty in Iraq. But don't worry, murderers and child rapists still qualify for Medicaid, Medicare A, B and subsidized Part D because they are "low income."

 

[CVMA544]

It is possible for DV to be less than 100% and not to be able to work or to work at a job they would have been able to because of the disablilty.

The idea of VA comp was to make up for the amount of wages a DV would loose in the workplace based on their disability.

For the state to say 80% I would say they set the bar a little too high when taking in consideration how the VA figures up percentages.

I know it is about saving the state money, so here is an idea to help keep the DV kids college fund up and going.

The IU basketball coach makes 1.2 million a year on a 7 year contract.

IU lays out coach's contract | The Journal Gazette | Fort Wayne, IN

Now I know IU basketball is so important in the defense of the country and cutting his salary would put the State of Indiana at risk of a terrorist attack, but hey I am willing to risk it.

Look at the atheletics dept salaries for coaches at IU or any Indiana State School.

But we need them and they have to paid that money. Why? Would nobody want a college education at IU if it didn't have a big sports program?

Would the campus have tumbleweeds blowing across it because suddenly nobody would want a quality education?

Here is another suggestion, quit paying for any education for anybody sentenced say 20 years or more. And why do people in for life get to go to school?

Why not use the profit from the prison industries to pay for those programs?

If we are gonna give them a college education then let them sign an enforcable contract to repay the cost of that education when they get out and get a job?

My kids and I signed a contract, or enlistment papers when we said we would serve in the military and we had to "earn" our education before we got it by serving.


Or better yet, lets have ALL people (No exceptions for the ruling class or politically connected) go and serve a couple years in the military or for those non military types do public service for four years and then give them the option of a free education.

Don't wanna stay in High School, fine drop out at 16, guess what, your public service starts right now until your normal age of release, which will be about 22 for non military service, because you have to finish HS to be in the military.

Think that would keep people in high school?

I can tell you as a DV I would rather be working.


Although one maybe 70% disabled it is possible to be considered unemployable for substantial or gainfull employment, in those cases the DV can be paid at the 100% rate but still for State purposes be only 70%.

In exceptional cases DV less than 70% combined disabilities or those with one disability at 60% can be paid at the 100% rate.

The VA uses a complicated formula to figure disabilities.

Example mine from the VA are 50%, 30%, 30%, 20%, 20%, 10%, 10% for a total of [STRIKE]170%[/STRIKE] 88% that is rounded up to 90%. However the body systems affected leave me unable to work so I am paid at the 100% rate.

Mine from the Army are 50%, 40%, 30%, 20%, 10%, 10%, 10% for a total of 87% which is rounded up to 90%.

 

[CVMA544]

OH, one more point, the National Guard recruiters use this as additional point in recruiting, don't think most consider it much when being "recruited", but since the wars have been going on for 10 years now and the time comes to pay the piper the Ruling Class is soooo willing to bail on on us.

Even at the national level there are those in congress (both sides) that want to cut from the VA and DOD (which affects retirements and disability also)

Vets are great, they use us to gain support when the wars are on, and now since it looks like we are gonna stand down in the middle east, they wanna cut funding to fix or support all of us they broke.

Why do they care? They have great medical plans. Let them take a number in the lowest priority class at the VA and wait for treatment like the vets.

 

[U.S. Patriot]

Taged, I will be sending out letters.

 

[mike8170]

I was reading this "gentlemans" bio and noticed that he was not a member of a VFW post. That tells me a lot right there.

Activities
Board of Directors, Noblesville Boys & Girls Club
Coordinator, Vietnam Wall Recreation, Hamilton County Veteran’s Organization, October 7, 04
Lay Leader, First United Methodist Church
Member of Elks Lodge #576
Member of American Legion
Member of Hamilton County 50 Club
Military Service
U.S. Army, 1969-1971, Discharged as First Lieutenant

Now, since he was discharged as an Officer, and Officers can be recalled to active duty until the age of 62, maybe we can pull some strings and have his a** sent to Afghanistan, then he can think about the bills he proposes.

I am in complete agreement with E5RANGER when it comes to the penal system, 4 walls and a couple of meals are all that is required.

 

[CarmelHP]

Kenley is one of the RINO anit-gunners that helped kill the campus carry bill a few sessions ago. Burn him.

 

[mike8170]

Kenley is one of the RINO anit-gunners that helped kill the campus carry bill a few sessions ago. Burn him.

 

[Pocketman]

This is all "funny money". The child receives a tuition fee waiver. No money changes hands. Hard to understand a veteran introducing such legislation. Must be his kids didn't qualify for the program.

 

[mike8170]

This is all "funny money". The child receives a tuition fee waiver. No money changes hands. Hard to understand a veteran introducing such legislation. Must be his kids didn't qualify for the program.

His kid(s) would have qualified as long as he met the requirements, and was smart enough to use them, due to the fact that he served during wartime, stateside or otherwise.

Plus, I don't look at this as "funny money", since I knew that I would earn this for my (future) children, which was a deciding factor on continuing my service. As to it being a tuition fee waiver, I would think that there has to be some type of a paper trail, therefore, accounts must be settled, no matter if "money" changes hands or not.