No knock warrants - do they scare you?

[mrjarrell]

I was really hoping for some insight into how one could prevent a Cory Maye incident.

Unfortunately, that's not up to you. It's up to the enforcers to NOT do things like this. They've been militarised and use SWAT teams and tactics when less or no force would accomplish the same thing in a much safer manner. They don't care about the safety of the inhabitants, only officer safety. That's why we've seen a rise in unnecessary shootings and killings or people and animals over the least few years.

 

[Colt556]

Also be aware that if it hits furniture, like a bed or couch, there's a serious risk of it starting a fire. Enforcers in a number of locales have burned peoples homes down with them.

Or Branch Dividian compounds.....

 

[b0r0b]

My house is such that I have severe (almost laughable) advantage to anyone attempting to enter my home. That being said, I would know in less than 3 seconds if who I'm dealing with is a gang of thugs or a SWAT team. It would take more than a single mans leg or 2 hits from a R.A.M to get through my second door, more than enough time for me to assess a situation.

Besides, the last time I saw 12 full grown men entering a dwelling, they were law enforcement. I have never witnessed 12 men "invading" someones home. Maybe back in the day, but things are much more on the coward level. (ie wait til vic leaves home, or vic's husband ect) Where I live, we have a 5'6 man who breaks into only women's homes at anywhere from 4-7am when their husbands leave for work.

Needless to say, not many groups of people are able to execute an entry with military precision like I am accustomed to without being involved somehow with LE. That being said, If you break into my house and don't identify yourself, whether falsely or accurately, I'm going to drop someone.

 

[Prometheus]

Besides, the last time I saw 12 full grown men entering a dwelling, they were law enforcement. I have never witnessed 12 men "invading" someones home. Maybe back in the day, but things are much more on the coward level.

How about 8, one of which was a AF Sergeant (the arrested an 8th person after this story, not sure where that article is though)?
Air Force Sergeant 1 of 7 Charged in Murder of Fla. Couple With 17 Kids - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

Like most people here, I don't consider someone whose kicked down a door, shinning a bright light (that makes visual ID impossible) incoherently screaming police as 'properly identifying' themselves.

I worried more about this when I lived in Hammond, the 6 years I lived there, the area went down hill quickly and I was in a ranch style house.

I live in a much nicer area now, my house would be very difficult to mistake for any of my neighbors had any LEO laid eyes on it prior to the actual raid, there isn't another house like it anywhere I've seen here. Also it's 2 stories so I have that extra second to defend a central choke point and fatal funnel... assuming intruders don't ladder the house and even then they'd have to choose the right window(s).

I also don't do anything illegal (aside from some speeding but no tickets let alone warrants) so there is zero reason for my door to be kicked in for any reason other than a criminal home invasion.

Who knows how it will turn out, but I'll be lighting up anything that breaks into my house.

If it is the police, they can knock on the door or even simpler, show up at my job. No need to initiate violence.

 

[downzero]

Already mentioned above.

Glad people got to it before I could. Sorry I didn't read the last couple pages of the thread before I posted.

I actually am working on a blog post about resisting law enforcement if they are breaking the law. The Supreme Court of Indiana seems to think that we no longer have the "priviledge" of resisting unlawful arrest. I actually think they read their own precedents wrong. More on this later.

 

[b0r0b]

How about 8, one of which was a AF Sergeant (the arrested an 8th person after this story, not sure where that article is though)?
Air Force Sergeant 1 of 7 Charged in Murder of Fla. Couple With 17 Kids - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

Like most people here, I don't consider someone whose kicked down a door, shinning a bright light (that makes visual ID impossible) incoherently screaming police as 'properly identifying' themselves.

I worried more about this when I lived in Hammond, the 6 years I lived there, the area went down hill quickly and I was in a ranch style house.

I live in a much nicer area now, my house would be very difficult to mistake for any of my neighbors had any LEO laid eyes on it prior to the actual raid, there isn't another house like it anywhere I've seen here. Also it's 2 stories so I have that extra second to defend a central choke point and fatal funnel... assuming intruders don't ladder the house and even then they'd have to choose the right window(s).

I also don't do anything illegal (aside from some speeding but no tickets let alone warrants) so there is zero reason for my door to be kicked in for any reason other than a criminal home invasion.

Who knows how it will turn out, but I'll be lighting up anything that breaks into my house.

If it is the police, they can knock on the door or even simpler, show up at my job. No need to initiate violence.

Wow! I didn't hear about that at all but again, I have never witnessed or "heard" of it. I do nothing wrong to be accused of anything or have police at my door for ANY reason other than a mistake.

Mistakes happen, but if police were to trash my door, scare the holy ghost out of everyone in my house and potentially hurt someone, I don't give two floating ****s what the damn law is or says, SOMEONE will pay for that.

They don't "accidentally" lock someone up for 15 years and then release them and say "sorry"..they give them hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars. This mistake falls under the same policy. If you break into my house BY ACCIDENT (E.G looking for 144 but bust down 114 or something) and you kill ANYTHING or anyone inside my house, there is and will be accountability SOMEWHERE.

I can't stress that enough. No law will ever suffice against the riot I cause when someone innocently sleeping in their own home is shot by LE on "accident". Eye for an eye..if the law wouldn't handle it, I would. You don't accidentally kill someones family and say oops, i'm an LE and covered by this or that.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Glad people got to it before I could. Sorry I didn't read the last couple pages of the thread before I posted.

I actually am working on a blog post about resisting law enforcement if they are breaking the law. The Supreme Court of Indiana seems to think that we no longer have the "priviledge" of resisting unlawful arrest. I actually think they read their own precedents wrong. More on this later.

is the indiana supreme court gonna stand in front of me and my family and take the bullet for us during an unlawful detainment and then accidental discharge or murderous discharge by police? no, i didnt think so. i think its funny some of the stupid laws people up on the hill make or rule on. I'd rather be judged by 12 then carried by 6. And i would gladly spend the rest of my life in prison or die, protecting my wife and child! maybe they need to become a working class hero and then see the world as it is down here in the valley?

yes, strong reference to John Lennon song, working class hero (listen to it)

 

[JBusch8899]

.

 

[E5RANGER375]

It also created a blaze that leveled an entire city block in Philadelphia, in 1985.

probly the cleanest that city has been since

 

[b0r0b]

probly the cleanest that city has been since

ooooh sick burn! grab teh ICE!

 

[JBusch8899]

.

 

[downzero]

probly the cleanest that city has been since

Hell yes!

I lived in Philly last summer. When my dad came to help me leave/drive home, he couldn't believe his eyes...and he's from a rough neighborhood in Chicago.

 

[Joe Williams]

It also created a blaze that leveled an entire city block in Philadelphia, in 1985.

That was a real travesty, a total police failure. If they'd been doing their jobs properly, the whole city would have burned. Would have made the world a better place.

Gotta live there, or near there, to appreciate my dislike, most likely. Our cradle of liberty has become a cesspool of crime, animal like behavior, and welfare slaves doing their level best to steal every penny working folks earn. To the point that everybody in the state subsidizes bus travel for third generation welfare jerkoffs in that city.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Should have been city hall.....that would have been like a giant mop.

WOW, we agree on something. i will mark this day for posterity

 

[finity]

There is no doubt in my mind that despite the mistake and surviving the outcome, one certainly be arrested, firearms seized, and highly likely to be subsequently charged.

The textbook answer is that a lack of criminal intent, should result in a not guilty verdict, though the real world outcome isn't so sure. Despite the verdict, the monies spent for a defense would likely result in one's bankruptcy, and imprisonment, if so occurred, would result in one's family without a source of income.

This isn't a lose-lose situation. Its a loss for the police officer shot and/or killed, with a lose-lose-lose-lose-lose situation for the homeowner.

So I guess we should all just turn in our guns & let the BG's & police do what they will to us then.

If I HAD a claymore, I wouldn't tell anyone about it. They'd find out the hard way

I do think police get a bad rap. There are SEVERAL great cops out there. Its the small handful that give them a bad name. If a cop was to break down your door in the middle of the night, it would be 'cause YOU'RE the bad guy that deserves to be raped with a night stick.

I have a lot of respect for the police. So much, that I put in my application the other day to be a reserve. I hope I get called. This is something I've been wanting to do for a long time.

That's what I meant. I can only see this happening if YOU were the bad guy. A drug dealer, child molester type of guy.

That was a joke. I figured purple text wouldn't have been needed.

I also said the police was breaking in like that in the middle of the night, it would probably be because you're a drug dealer or a child molester. Someone who DESERVES to be, well, you know.

I never said if I was a cop, I would actually do that.

I just said the person would probably be a bad guy that deserves that. I never said that the police SHOULD punish the bad guys. I know it's the job of the courts. And I agree with that. And I never said if I WAS a cop, I would punish anyone.

This a very unfortunate series of posts on your part.

It's not funny at all to "joke" about the police sodomizing someone with a nightstick (or beating up Mexicans) because IT ACTUALLY HAPPENS & it's not always the "drug dealer, child molester type guy" or "someone who DESERVES to be, well, you know". Sometimes it's an innocent person who's done absolutely nothing to "deserve" it.

If you really are convinced that the only houses that the cops go into with these "no-knocks" belong to the BG's you need to really objectively read the posts before & since yours that show otherwise. "Blind justice" doesn't mean following along blindly after law enforcement, no matter what they do wrong.

I have a lot of respect for the police. So much, that I [STRIKE]put in my application the other day to be a reserve[/STRIKE] will look the other way, make jokes & try to give justification to whatever they do, even if it causes loss of innocent life.

There. I fixed it for you.

We have plenty of cops who already do that. We don't need any more.

 

[theweakerbrother]

Man, I just read a lot of bravado in this thread. I will add honest response to what I would do in the situation. I would not rely on shouting 'police' as enough testimony that they are truly the police.

If INGO members get served a no knock warrant, we'll never know it.

1. They will go to jail for armed response.
2. They will go to the morgue for armed response.
3. They were served one, froze and wont admit to it on the internet.

First one to get served a no-knock warrant gets a BAMF wallet, unlimited rep points and three lbs of bacon.

As a police officer, I can't imagine being a willing participant in a no-knock warrant. Why let a little thing called rights get in the way of a good war-on-drugs bust? So what if you went to the wrong house?

I know, I know... I was just doing my job.

Superior Orders - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[thompal]

If you identify your target before you point a gun at it (like you always should) would you still point a gun at an LEO once you identified them as such?

The problem is that from what I've seen, the initial entry is often made by guys wearing black BDUs, black Kpots, and black masks. It doesn't seem that dynamic entries are often made by street cops in police uniforms. Compound that with the fact that it would probably be very dark, with the exception of the flashlights boring into your eyes, and you are possibly coming out of a deep sleep.

At best, it would take you a few moments to realize that the armed intruders are police, and in that moment, a citizen's first reaction is probably going to be to reach for his gun.

 

[thompal]

I want the FBI team coming in!!! Best LE SWAT team in the country!!!! and where did they get trained??? Ft. Benning, by Rangers!!!

Sure. Maybe they'll bring Lon Horiuchi. I'm sure there might be some nursing mothers to shoot.

 

[jeremy]

It is amazing what a person can do with a little time on their side...
That and a knowledge of modern plastics and steels and how to use them...

 

[JBusch8899]

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