New Indianapolis Range Looking for "Rules" Input

[turn n shoot]

Last week I started a thread about my friend's new range that is being built in Indy at 55th and Keystone. I stopped in yesterday: unfortunately due to what looks like an error in the plans construction has been delayed by about three weeks. The good news is that both ranges are coming along nicely. Both ranges, the short 25 yd range, and the longer tactical range are looking real good. The lighting that is being installed is nice and bright. It is going to be brighter than any range I have ever shot in.

I have a question for you guys: I noticed in my previous thread, and in other postings in the Forums that "unreasonable," and "ridiculous" range rules are mentioned regularly. Right now the range rules are being written, and I sure would like your input as to what you guys think are unreasonable rules. Keep in mind that many of the rules are written to keep everyone SAFE. Shooting at an indoor range can be dangerous if certain "rules" are not followed, BUT the owner has it in mind that shooting at his range should also be very ENJOYABLE. He has certain philosophies in mind . . . . Such as: I alluded to his range pricing. He has never liked it when he went to a range, and got nickle and dimed to death! He doesn't intend to do it at his range! You guys will be more than pleased when prices are announced.

In any event, going along with his philosophy of not nickle and diming you. He wants a SAFE range, but not one that has so many rules that you can't have a good time. So, what do you guys think are "unreasonable," and ridiculous" rules??

Thanks,
Tom

 

[Trigger Time]

I don't like being video taped when I shoot

 

[turn n shoot]

Trigger time. Are you saying that they come out on the range with a video camera, or are you talking about normal security cameras? There are security cameras everywhere video taping you. Every store you go into nowadays is doing that.

 

[singlesix]

You can't please everyone. Whatever rules you decide upon just enforce it! I walked into a local range and there was a waiting line, people sitting in the main lobby, one person had an uncased SKS rifle. The rules clearly state firearms must be holstered or cased unless on the firing line. So in a round about way answering your question, for me it is safety first, I can live with "unreasonable" rules. If I don't like them I can always go somewhere else.

 

[turn n shoot]

Single six: I heard that . . . Of course, rules need to be enforced the same with everyone! In that ranges defense; It sounds like it was very busy, and crowded. Was it possible that none of the employees saw the customer with the uncased rifle yet? I do understand where you are coming from though. If he was seen. A safety rule should come first.

BTW: If it were me. I would have excused myself from another customer. Asked the man if it were his first time at the range. Explained the rules.
Asked him for his rifle. Made sure it was cleared. At that time I would have told him that he could leave, or I would put his rifle behind the counter until he was ready to shoot. I would not have kicked him out first time!! I would have told him it had to be cased next time around. If he did not have a case at home. I would have offered to sell him one. All that said: I don't know what the rules regarding this at the range will be. Just what I would do.

 

[nettinyahoo]

Rule: Loaded carry firearms must remain holstered until you are on the firing line. Do not allow unholstering and clearing rounds at the gun counter.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Rule: Loaded carry firearms must remain holstered until you are on the firing line. Do not allow upholstering and clearing rounds at the gun counter.

THIS! And dont go full derp and require that carry weapons be unloaded and cased prior to arriving on the property (including a prohibition on handling said gun in the privacy of your car in the lot).

Drawing from the holster should not be prohibited. Some ranges dont have an official posted policy and just ask that you do so carefully with safety in mind, and not try to beat the clock. I think that is reasonable.

 

[Beowulf]

The rules that turn me off from a range:

1. Unreasonable ammo restrictions (i.e. no steel cased, must buy from shop, etc). Obviously, I don't really have a problem with them limiting things like tracer rounds or actual AP rounds, but other than that it is should be open to whatever people want to bring in, limited only to what the backstop can handle (so maybe leave the 20mm Lahti at home and wait for a nicer day to go to an outdoor range).

2. No full auto or rapid fire. As an owner of now 2 transferrable MGs, I'm not going to bother paying money to a range that won't let me actually utilize the features of my weapons that I paid so much money for. If your back stop and ceiling/floors aren't set up to handle that, you've clearly designed your range incorrectly.

Other than that, I'm okay with rules that are in place for real safety.

Obviously, ranges are free to make whatever rules they want, just as I'm free to take my money elsewhere. That's why I shoot at Parabellum and BGF (before the fire) and not Tim's, for example

 

[Leo]

Don't put any tables, shelves behind the firing line. EVERY place that has one ends up with idiots loading and handling guns behind the backs of people who are shooting properly. Bad situation.

 

[SSGSAD]

You can't please everyone. Whatever rules you decide upon just enforce it! I walked into a local range and there was a waiting line, people sitting in the main lobby, one person had an uncased SKS rifle. The rules clearly state firearms must be holstered or cased unless on the firing line. So in a round about way answering your question, for me it is safety first, I can live with "unreasonable" rules. If I don't like them I can always go somewhere else.

^^^^^THIS^^^^^ and enforce the rules EQUAL and IMPARTIAL !!!!!! If the boss, is going to let his buddy, break the rules, then do it when no one else, is around. If most people see someone doing something, they are most likely going to do the same thing .....

 

[Tactically Fat]

To build upon what Leo has said:

have a coat-hook or two within each shooting station/booth. And perhaps, if possible, even a shelf down under the "main" shooting / loading table.

 

[zippy23]

I really like the rule of no loading mags unless on the table. Loading mags behind people is no good, especially if they insert the mag as they are walking up to the line.

 

[turn n shoot]

Thank you guys for more input. Again the rules are not made yet, and I don't know what the final rules will be, but my thoughts on some of the above are: {Keeping carry guns holstered outside the actual range} Carry guns should be kept holstered. You only draw it to use it . . . I personally wouldn't want to be in a gun store with a bunch of loaded carry guns being waved around, fiddled with, being unloaded, loaded, etc.} I would be comfortable with people unloading their guns at the counter if I knew what their gun experience was, but most of the time you don't know. Would you want to be next to a novice in a store while he pulls out his loaded gun . . .

Camera Monkey, I think your suggestion on drawing from the holster inside the range is a good one. I can see why there would be such a rule though. Some people think that they were Quick Draw McGraw in another life. I wouldn't want to be next to Wyatt Earp out on the range while shooting. I would think that moderation would have to be enforced.

I am sure everyone sees the need for banning AP, Tracers, incendiary ammo at a range. The damage caused could be extensive. I am not sure, but banning steel cased is probably for the range's convenience in selling fired brass. There could be another reason, I don't know. I do know that at this range the fired brass isn't going to be sold to some big company. It is going to be made available to the people that shoot there.

On full auto, and rapid fire: I am almost sure that full auto will be allowed. The walls floors etc. can easily handle it, but if you are shooting the walls, floor, ceiling, you have no business shooting full auto. I personally don't see the range owner banning double taps, and training shooting, but I also don't see him allowing fast crazy shooting either.

On ceilings, floors, and walls. They can certainly handle ammo hits, but for example if you hit the ceiling back stops they are covered with heavy acoustic tile that must be replaced if shot up. I don't think that any range doesn't expect some of this, but would not put up with too much.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Thats why the ranges I know dont actually post the rule if they dont prohibit it. They let you ask if its permitted, and you are then given that caveat as part of the acknowledgement. I agree that guns should be holstered until in a bay on the range. Unholstering outside the range is a bad idea, regardless of how experienced the person is. I just cant stand ranges that take it that step further that says absolutely no unholstering, even in your bay. (and unload/case the gun you want to shoot before you get there)

 

[turn n shoot]

Thank you for more good suggestions. The owner has traveled to many gun ranges all over the country to see how things are done, and how to have a super safe range.

As far as enforcing the rules equally is concerned . . . I am the boss' buddy, and believe me I wouldn't even think of trying to get away with something. Particularly if it was unsafe in ANY way. He would treat me as he would anyone else. I have no doubts what so ever.

 

[turn n shoot]

On shooting your carry gun at the range: I carry 24/7. I don't shoot the gun I am carrying when I go to a range. I leave it on my hip, holstered. If I want to shoot that particular gun; I carry a different one. I realize that not everyone has a stable to pick from, and for those people I feel confident that adequate provisions will be made for them.

 

[Thegeek]

Only problems I have at indoor ranges is brass. Either I'm losing mine, or getting hit with someone else's. I'd like to see a range have some netting or something on the right side wall to either catch, or at a minimum dampen the brass so it's not being thrown everywhere. Even a cotton mesh curtain would be enough to stop it and let it drop straight down.

And yes.... ENFORCE the rules. That's the biggest problem today are people ignoring the rules because they know most people won't confront.

Drawing from a holster to fire, is no-bueno. I also carry to the range, but I unload and bag it in the parking lot. Or that firearm never leaves the holster. But, a dedicated lane or two for people to practice draw and fire with added protections would be a nice touch.

And for the love of god, have a hand washing station!

 

[turn n shoot]

On shooting your carry gun at the range: I carry 24/7. I don't shoot the gun I am carrying when I go to a range. I leave it on my hip, holstered. If I want to shoot that particular gun; I carry a different one. I realize that not everyone has a stable to pick from, and for those people I feel confident that adequate provisions will be made for them.

 

[turn n shoot]

Whoops, I see I double posted above, sorry about that.

Even though this thread is young I can see some definite trends. Nobody likes rules that are there just to make the range owner a little fatter by nickle and diming them. Nobody likes rules that they don't understand, and therefore see no need for it. Nobody likes rules that aren't enforced equally. Gun owners as a group are usually a more independent group than average, and certainly don't like the idea of "Mom" standing over them, and watching every move. I don't think that anyone would complain about a rule that is there to keep everyone safe, and they understand the reason behind the rule. Not everyone is going to be pleased with rules.

So far I have gotten some valuable input, and I have been discussing some with the owner of the range. He knows that the rules won't please everyone, but there have to be some. Right now shooting has a huge number of new people that have just started. They have to know what is right, and wrong. They are not really proficient with their guns yet, and unfortunately rules for the new shooter must also apply to the experienced shooter, or they would not be enforced uniformly, as has been suggested, more than once, above.

Still looking for more input. The range just plain wants to be a place where you enjoy coming, and are safe too!

 

[turn n shoot]

GEEK: Some good suggestions. If shooting at the range properly the dividers should keep brass from hitting the next person. The problem being, you loose too much brass over the line. I don't like that either. If I was the RO at the time I would broom your brass back to you when you were done. You may not get all of it, or you may get more . . . I don't know, but I would imagine that would be allowed, no problem. The owner wants you to come back. He isn't concerned about sticking your brass in his pocket. Of course, he will be gathering, and selling brass, but as I mentioned above, it is going back to the users, not out the door to some big reloading company. It will take a lot of extra effort sorting, bagging, etc. He won't just give it away to you, but I am sure he isn't planning on getting rich by doing it either. I anticipate very reasonable prices. He even mentioned some special promotions with used brass.

There is a nice big restroom facility next to the range where you can clean the lead, and powder off.

There are two rooms with six lanes each. I could see your suggested arrangement being implemented if the range isn't full.