My Brand New Taurus 856 Defender

[Bassat]

I picked it up this morning. FIrst off, I like the flat black finish. Report say it is not really durable, but I think it looks good. I could not resist taking it out of the box in the parking lot. The trigger is absolutely horrendous, worst I've ever felt. Heavy, gritty, grinding, and I can feel every part of the internals engaging or moving or whatever they do in there. My CA Off duty was gritty out of the box, also; It is much better now. This is notably worse, and compounded by being extremely heavy. The CA is advertised as 12#. I don't have a scale, but this is way heavier than the CA. When I got home I loaded up with snap caps and got in 600 DA dry fires before I hit the range this afternoon. It had smoothed out considerably, but is still very heavy. The range trip was a mistake. After 600 dry fires, my fingers/hands/arms were worn out. With the heavy trigger and tired hands, I struggled to get 5-inch groups at 5 yards. I tried SA; it was better but not by a lot. The SA trigger has a noticeable gritty movement (maybe 1/16") before it breaks. So I got home from the range, mowed the lawn, and sat down for 200 more DA, and 100 SA snap-cap dry fires. I was so worn out when I stopped that I could not cock the hammer with my left thumb any more. I imagine I'll be a bit sore from the elbows down tomorrow.

Summary so far. I like the look, the size, and the weight (all steel) of it. The trigger is, honestly, the worst I've ever operated. Quite ironically, the best revolver triggers I've ever owned were both on .44 Specials, a Taurus and a Rossi. I bought both used, a 441 & a 720, IIRC. Some comments on fit and finish when I have time for photos.

 

[92FSTech]

It sounds like that one may be worth opening up and cleaning and polishing. There's probably some burrs, machine marks, or grit in there making it rough. If they're bad enough it could even be binding and making the pull heavier than it actually should be.

Does anybody make spring kits for the Taurus? I know Apex and Wilson Combat both make kits for Smith, and I'm sure there are others. I don't like to go too light as you can get light strikes, but some guns are just unmanageable from the factory and need a little help. I'd start with a careful polish and if that doesn't make it better look into spring kits.

 

[BiscuitsandGravy]

https://www.gunsprings.com/

Is what you seek. I have read that Wolff may produce springs for some of the brand names.

 

[Bassat]

Thanks. Before I order any parts, I'll open it up to see if anything is obviously wrong/bent/whatever. After 1,000 DA cycles, it is smoother (not good, just better), but still VERY heavy. I've already found a good video on 856 complete takedown.

 

[Bassat]

Ok, after a night of rest (me, not the gun), my fingers/hands/arms are not so worn out. The trigger is way better than it was, but still heavy. That is a common complaint in the reviews I've read of this gun. As such, I am not ready to open it up, just yet. Moving on....

I may as well mention here that I tried to run some of my left-over MagTech ammo through this gun. Out of 24 rounds, I got four misfires; only one of them went off on the second strike. I am writing that off as an ammo problem, not a gun problem. Also fired 24 rounds of Remington 130gr FMJ with no problems. Please note, I had problems with the MagTech ammo in my CA Off Duty. That gun has fired several hundred rounds of NOT-MagTech ammo without problems. Even my S&W 442 misfired a few of the MagTechs.

The orange front sight is visible indoors during the day, and quite obvious at after dark. One point of comparison, though. My P365 had two green dots on the rear sight and one green dot on the front sight. Not a huge deal as I won't be target shooting at 25 yards in the dark.

The HKS DS (Colt, T856) works just fine with this gun.

It is not lost on me that the mat-black finish looks no different dirty than it does clean. Bonus point for the 856? Gonna go clean it, now. Hopefully I'll have time for some photos this morning.

 

[Bassat]

Got it cleaned up, got photos. Nothing remarkable about the fit and finish. It comes packed in a cardboard box, with the shown extras. I like that they include a real, workable lock, and a snap plate (the orange thing, better name?). Both would be useful to a person w/o other options. I'd like to mention a few of the design feature that I really like.

Topmost on my list is the full-length ejector rod. It allows for easy and complete ejection of spent rounds in one smack. My method is: cylinder open, barrel vertical, gun in my left hand holding the cylinder all the way open with two fingers, then smack the ejector with an open palm of right hand. Other folks may have other ways; this get my gun empty, positively and quickly. As mentioned previously, the HKS DS (Colt/Taurus 856) Speed loader works just fine.

There is also just a smidge more room between the top of the barrel and the underside of the top strap. I clean such tight spots w/wire bristle pipe cleans. On this gun they actually fit into the space. That is not true of my CA, or either of the S&Ws. Easy-peasy cleaning in a usually tight spot.

There is a spring-loaded detent pin in the top of the crane that fits into a notch when closed. I don't know if it helps with anything, but I assume it provide tighter, more secure locking of the cylinder in place. I like that attention to detail in the design.

 

[MrSmitty]

I’ve seen these at work, and I love the look, sorry to hear about the trigger troubles, hopefully it will smooth out soon. I love the 3” barrel on a small revolver…mine is an older 5 shot model 85 though. Good luck with yours !

 

[Bassat]

Thanks. The trigger is much better already. Mostly smooth, just heavy DA. About 30 years ago I had a 2" Taurus 85CH, 5-shot. I liked it, and it had a nice trigger.

 

[Bassat]

This gun did not come with the TSS (Totally Stupid Security) lock. That makes me happy.

 

[Mgderf]

This gun did not come with the TSS (Totally Stupid Security) lock. That makes me happy.

We call that the "Hilary hole".

 

[Bassat]

We call that the "Hilary hole".

Now I am even more happy I don't have one. My 442 doesn't have one, either, nor my CA Off Duty. Why does my 686+ have one?

 

[92FSTech]

All the new-production guns with exposed hammer spurs have them. Some of the Centennial models are offered without them. Usually the higher-end, performance-center models. So clearly Smith knows it's a desireable "upgrade" to not have the idiotic thing on there.

I recently removed the lock and installed a plug in my 329PD. I have a few Smiths with the stupid lock, and while I hate the idea of them, they've never been a problem over thousands of rounds. Just last week I had my first ever issue with one...the recoil on that lightweight .44 is so intense that it caused the safety flag to pop up on it's own and locked up the gun. The lock itself did not engage, so all I had to do was manually push the flag back down, but I can't have that if I ever need it for real. We're going to Alaska next week and I have no desire to become bear crap, so I ponied up the $40 and plugged the hole. The circular plug blends nicely but it still leaves a gap next to the hammer where the flag used to be. Not perfect, but IMO still better than owning a "self-locking" revolver.

 

[Bassat]

I have a total of ~1500 DA dry-fire cycles and ~300 SA dry-fire cycles on this gun. Also have opened/closed the cyliner 100+ times. The DA trigger is fairly smooth now, and breaks with no warning, but still heavy. For now, I'll call it a safety feature. A trip to the range will settle that issue. I don't plan on doing much/any SA shooting, but 3" barrel should at least be respectable at 10-20 yard. The SA trigger is also heavy, and still has a good bit (1/16") of creep before it breaks. I am trying to train my finger/brain to just give it the full-creep pull in one smooth motion. As mentioned previously, I sometimes struggle with doing that for double action. It is just strange to have that much movement in single action. My 686+ certainly does not have any noticeable creep in SA. I've got busy day this Wednesday (my usual range day) so I won't be doing any shooting this week. Perhaps next week (5/29). I suppose it is worth mentioning that after 36 hours in the safe, the glow-in-the-dark night sight doesn't.

 

[Bassat]

Yesterday, I compared the Taurus 856 trigger to my other revolvers: Charter Arms Off Duty, S&W 442, S&W 686+. The Taurus is the heaviest of the bunch, but not by as much as I thought. The difference is noticeable, but not huge. After 1500+ dry fires, with snap-caps, the trigger is way smoother than out of the box. Note: the Charter Arms only took a 500, and it is a lighter/smoother trigger than the Taurus. The Taurus 856 is shootable as is, though another trip to the range is necessary at this point.

Now to the question of the day. I have been reading about Wolff, and Galloway, replacement springs (hammer and trigger return) for this this gun. Both are easy to install, and both reduce trigger pull by about 20%. I've seen reviews that praise the replacements, and others that say, "They work, but it is not worth risking reliability in a carry/car gun."
Any opinions out there? About either brand of springs? About the effectiveness and reliability of the gun (specifically T856) with new springs?

 

[92FSTech]

I can't speak to the Taurus, but I've had to shim the strain screw on Smith revolvers to get adequate force to reliably ignite primers with aftermarket spring kits. As such, I usually just polish and don't replace springs, unless it's really bad.

The only way to know for sure if an aftermarket spring kit is reliable is to try it. Thankfully they're usually pretty inexpensive. If they don't work, you can always swap the factory springs back in.

 

[gregkl]

I had a model 85CH. My wife could not cycle the gun. Trigger pull weight was higher than the max 15lb scale when I checked it. I took it apart, stoned everything(except the sear. I don't touch those), polished many of the parts smooth and the DA trigger pull was at 9 lbs. My wife could now shoot it.

Without replacing parts and doing 1000's of dryfire(which my hands couldn't take), I took off at least 6 lbs of DA trigger weight off that revolver. It was sweet.

Wish I would not have sold it.

 

[Bassat]

I had a model 85CH. My wife could not cycle the gun. Trigger pull weight was higher than the max 15lb scale when I checked it. I took it apart, stoned everything(except the sear. I don't touch those), polished many of the parts smooth and the DA trigger pull was at 9 lbs. My wife could now shoot it.

Without replacing parts and doing 1000's of dryfire(which my hands couldn't take), I took off at least 6 lbs of DA trigger weight off that revolver. It was sweet.

Wish I would not have sold it.

I had an 85CH many years ago. Good gun with a nice trigger. I got it used, though. Someone else made it sweet for me. I like to tinker, so I think I'll end up ordering a spring kit. Just trying to decide between Wolff and Galloway. The install looks butt-easy, and as 92FSTech said above, the switch is easily reversible.

 

[Bassat]

I read somewhere, perhaps in this thread, that leaving the hammer fully cocked for several hours/days can reduce the tension of the trigger-return spring and the hammer spring. I left my 856 in the safe, unloaded, for about two days with the hammer cocked. It sure feels lighter to me. Am I imagining things? Wishful thinking?

 

[DadSmith]

I read somewhere, perhaps in this thread, that leaving the hammer fully cocked for several hours/days can reduce the tension of the trigger-return spring and the hammer spring. I left my 856 in the safe, unloaded, for about two days with the hammer cocked. It sure feels lighter to me. Am I imagining things? Wishful thinking?

Wheeler Manual Trigger Pull Scale with 8oz to 8lb Value Range for Gunsmithing, Shooting Competitions, and Trigger Adjustments https://a.co/d/aJc38IF

Test your trigger pull weight. If the above isn't enough here's this one


SNAIL TRAIL 50lbs Spring Fish Weighing Scale, Portable Fishing Weight Gauge with Hook, Hand Held Manual Pull Weigher, Hanging Luggage Drag Scale, Gifts for Men https://a.co/d/234XcyP

 

[Bassat]

I have not had a range opportunity for a few weeks, and next week is out, too. Just a few thoughts. I am sure I have dry-fired this gun at least 2,000 times in double action, and several hundred in single action (all with A-Zoom snap caps). That has reaped a few benefits. First, the trigger is much smoother now, in both DA&SA. There is still a bit of noticeable creep in SA. I have to go very sloooowwwwllllyyy to notice it. With normal SA pull, it is fine. The DA is still the heaviest of my revolvers, but not horrible. Another benefit of all that dry firing is that both my trigger fingers are stronger. The gun is shootable as is. I will get in one more range session before I decide whether or not to purchase/install the Galloway spring set. If I can get good groups DA out to 7 yards, and SA two-handed at 20 yards, I will probably not install the spring set. For the most part, I don't see a problem with a slightly heavier trigger in gun intended for high-stress situations.

Sidebar: all this trigger finger and grip exercise seems to be paying off with the other revolvers, also. We'll see when I get back to the range.