Lance Armstrong

[mcolford]

What are your thoughts on him being stripped of all his Tour De France win's?

He passed how many drug tests in his career.. But they are still obsessed about this. Ridiculous. Maybe if its such a big issue, they should step it up and conduct better testing for alleged performance enhancing drugs. Damn crybabies!

I truly dont blame him for giving up the fight. Hes always going to get accused of stupid crap, as some people wont let stuff go.

 

[indytechnerd]

Witch Hunt, IMHO. Funny how all the people who are certain he's dirty are only talking because they got busted. How many other riders for USPS and the other Lance Teams have not been busted? Seems like an awful lot of "well he was doing it, too". Yet, he's had more blood and urine tests than anyone else in the sport, and none have come back positive...even during 2nd runs where they were looking for something specific.

His response was basically a big "F YOU" to the cycling world.

 

[mcolford]

Witch Hunt, IMHO. Funny how all the people who are certain he's dirty are only talking because they got busted. How many other riders for USPS and the other Lance Teams have not been busted? Seems like an awful lot of "well he was doing it, too". Yet, he's had more blood and urine tests than anyone else in the sport, and none have come back positive...even during 2nd runs where they were looking for something specific.

His response was basically a big "F YOU" to the cycling world.

Very much so a Witch Hunt. Why cant some people accept that some people are just bad ass at a sport!

 

[chris46131]

Agreed. The number i heard was more than five hundred tests over his whole career and none of them failed (I can't personally verify this). Seems like that should be enough.

And i don't blame him for not fighting it anymore either, it's not like they're going to stop. One thing to remember is, they can't truly strip him of his wins. Yes they can choose not to acknowledge them on paper and in the record books, but he still won - can't change that.

 

[JustAMom]

I don't blame him for ending the fight. He has been putting up with this for 13 years. Enough is enough!

 

[mcolford]

Just read that his foundation "LiveSTRONG" averages $3,500 in donations a day. Friday (the day they took his name off the record books).. $80,000 in donations to the foundation. That says something!

 

[Naptown]

Even though the 500 tests never tested POSITIVE, they did show MANIPULATION. It's still not a positive...

 

[perry]

If he didn't cheat, then he beat a field of cheaters and is a great champion.

If he did cheat, then he beat a field of cheaters and is a great champion.

What I wonder is, if the USADA is going to ignore the evidence that is supported by drug tests, then why do the drug tests at all? Why not just rely on people turning each other in for doping? That's the standard they are setting by taking all of his wins away -- ignore the scientific results and judge based on hearsay. He's basically guilty unless he can prove himself innocent. I don't care if Lance did or didn't cheat, I don't follow professional cycling and his physical feats are feats regardless of the doping, but the USADA is coming out looking like a bunch of amateur crybabies to me.

 

[chris46131]

The thing is, if they're going to second guess all the test results, why do the tests to begin with? That should be the whole point of testing - to make decisions based on the results.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I personally think he cheated, but there's no way to prove it. Again, it's just my personal opinion but, a guy on a team where most of the members had been busted for doping, and the only one that wasn't just happens to be the best rider??? He could simply be a freak, but playing the odds one would think that he was guilty, and probably just could afford better drugs.

 

[downzero]

There's no way to take Lance's titles from him. No matter what, he's one of the greatest American athletes ever. Grant tour road cycling is one of the most grueling sports on earth.

 

[Stschil]

He thumbed his nose at the slanted process. He did say that he would possibly pursue in civil court.

 

[chris46131]

I personally think he cheated, but there's no way to prove it. Again, it's just my personal opinion but, a guy on a team where most of the members had been busted for doping, and the only one that wasn't just happens to be the best rider??? He could simply be a freak, but playing the odds one would think that he was guilty, and probably just could afford better drugs.

I can see how the circumstances MIGHT be suspicious...but is "guilt by association" really sufficient to try and strip a guy of a career's worth of achievements??

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

I personally think he cheated, but there's no way to prove it. Again, it's just my personal opinion but, a guy on a team where most of the members had been busted for doping, and the only one that wasn't just happens to be the best rider??? He could simply be a freak, but playing the odds one would think that he was guilty, and probably just could afford better drugs.

How many of Lance's actual teammates during his TDF seasons have been caught doping? That's a difficult stat to track down. One would have to go back and research each team for each year - then search each cyclist individually and see if they were busted in any particular year when they may have been teammates.

IIRC - there were VERY very few USPS "Posties" who were busted for doping - especially while L.A. was on the team.

What I find intriguing: USADA was fine letting him keep the championships while he was appealing / fighting. But as soon as he folds (For whatever reasons); they strip him of the titles. How much sense does that make?

Guilty before being proved.

I also wonder what authority that the USADA has in stripping him of those titles - since they were events in another country. And the UCI really wants the results from the USADA before they'll pass their own judgement.

IMO - who cares what the USADA says. It's the UCI that holds the REAL authority to strip the titles.

-J-

 

[drillsgt]

I personally think he cheated, but there's no way to prove it. Again, it's just my personal opinion but, a guy on a team where most of the members had been busted for doping, and the only one that wasn't just happens to be the best rider??? He could simply be a freak, but playing the odds one would think that he was guilty, and probably just could afford better drugs.

There's no doubt he was a freak, his VO2 was ridiculous and later I think a teammate even did better than he did.

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

There's no doubt he was a freak, his VO2 was ridiculous and later I think a teammate even did better than he did.

This is HUGE in professional sports - especially ones that need long-term stamina.

He also produces less lactic acid than the average bear.

Doping or not - cheating or not (We may never know 100% of the truth) - he really was a freak of nature.

He'd have been "good" had he not gotten cancer. The way his body re-built itself after treatments and rehab, though, are what vaulted him into the limelight.

-J-

 

[hornadylnl]

What does its say about us as a society when people dope for something that doesn't even ****ing matter?

 

[femurphy77]

He passed all drug tests relevent for that time period. To come out with a test several years later is just a witch hunt. Besides the doping organization doesn't have a right to negate trophies by another organization. Nothing to see here folks, move along.

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

What does its say about us as a society when people dope for something that doesn't even ****ing matter?

Define "doesn't even ****ing matter".

 

[SmileDocHill]

You can test for a substance but you cannot test for certain blood doping techniques. It takes a time line of tests to prove it and it can be proven. They have the data to prove it or they would not have made the official declaration. They are now not given a venue to demonstrate or their proof since he bowed out before allowing it to go to trial.

One technique I'm aware of:
Basically you draw your own blood, spin it down or isolate the oxygen carrying cells, and store them. Your body senses this and makes more to boost the counts back up to normal. When you are racing you inject the stored ones and have a superhero amount of oxygen carrying capacity. It is, however, your blood so it isn't like testing for a particular drug. It takes looking at many tests over time to positively prove that his blood counts do not follow trends that are physiologically possible.

A typical example of how this would look can be found in many of his Tour De France performances. It is many days into it and like everyone else he is showing wear and fatigue, but the next day he shows up to put on a performance like he has had a weeks rest. Many parts of his body are still tired but his blood has been replenished with fresh cells greatly reducing his recovery time and ability to perform the next day. One point in time is impossible to prove so everyone bit their tongue and said "wow what a comeback" when in the back of everyone's mind it was obvious.

I love Lance, he got his start in triathlons at the same time I was getting into them. The guy is a machine, no question. For fleeing moments I understood blood physiology to a level that makes it easy to see how proof can be certain and not suspect. At least to those that understand the nerdy details of blood physiology.