Heat without power

[Yellowjeep]

Plug your house in next door and crank up the heat.sorry all the other guys took the good ones.

 

[Molly Belle]

We have the same issue here, and I bought the Little Buddy heater. It is indoor safe, but I haven't used it in the house yet. We did use it camping in a canvas tent in November. It was 35-40 degrees outside, and we kept pretty toasty. It was $75 (on sale), but it does give me peace of mind that we can keep our kids warm even without power. They have a kit so that you can use a regular propane tank, but so far I have just been buying the small tanks at walmart whenever I remember them. Even in the tent we only went through 2 tanks a night. Granted, it was a smaller space, but there also wasn't any insulation.

As a kid, my Dad always used Kerosene heaters and they really put out the heat too. Someday, I would love to have a woodstove, but I don't know if I can talk hubby into it, as he already has to cut wood for his parents.

 

[Zoub]

Think big and small

Kero heaters in large rooms

Smaller heater buddies and Coleman sportcats in bedrooms and bathrooms. Don't get the double buddies and mega big crap for double the price. 1 is none so 4 smaller ones are better than 2. Also these heaters tend to have tip over safeties, low O2 sensors AND are indoor safe. Also, propane is easy to deal with. A small 1500 BTU Sportcat can heat a bathroom in the morning. 10,00 BTU Heater Buddies do fine in bedrooms or typical small dens or offices.

For safety reasons like Carbon Monoxide poisoning, these are a good idea to use in rooms you sleep in.

One serious suggestion, if you use 20lb tanks, do not use the rental/exchange ones. Buy your own tanks and have them refilled. I have seen larger tanks leak and they were always the POS ones you exchange. VERY dangerous indoors if they leak. You can put it outside and run a hose inside.

But in general for indoors, using Kero for large heaters and 1lb tanks on small portable propane heaters is fairly safe.

The classic old school tank top Mr. Heater is nice for heat and cooking.

Keep the Salamander style heaters in your garage but they need electricity to run anyway so unless you have a battery bank, no use to you.

Typically in Indiana, all of these heaters will be half price in about 4 to 6 weeks. Go find the ones you want at Menards, Lowes and similar stores and watch them every week. Of the 7 or 8 heaters I have, I have never paid more than 50% for any of them.

 

[Zoub]

Also, if you run Propane, it is a no brainer to add a hot water heater or just use a tank top heater to warm some water. Also add some small cooking gear like a Coleman stove or camp grill that use propane. Also, look at walmart for the cheap $15 propane globe lanterns. They just screw on top of a 1lb cylinder. You can turn them down way low. They make a great small area light and of course add some heat in the process.

All of this gear can be used for emergencies, camping or just a day in the park.

Kero stays home in reserve for the bad storms.

Study some of these products

Mr. Heater - America's Most Popular Portable Heaters

Toyotomi, U.S.A. - Portable Heater - DC-90 Kero-Sun

Coleman - Emergency Gear - Stoves


Then you add a propane or tri-fuel generator to run your whole house heater

 

[Sailor]

Think really small. Heat your body not a room.

 

[gunman41mag]

i say old fashion love making

 

[Molly Belle]

i say old fashion love making

A lot of people agree. That is why the hospitals are always busy 9 months after a power outage. Lol

 

[CountryBoy19]

Maybe a bit late to the game but I was in your same boat 3 1/2 yrs ago when I bought my house. I didn't have time or money to rectify my situation in my first year in my house but by year 2 I fixed it.

This is the survival forum so long-term planning is something I always take into consideration. That weighed heavily on my decision. Also, running cost and potential money savings. My electric bills were close to $400/mo the first winter. That was with my thermostat set to 58 and most of the house closed off. I froze my butt off that first winter just trying to save up some money for my upcoming wedding. I knew the next winter was going to be much worse after we got married and my wife moved in; she doesn't like the cold.

I ultimately ended up going with a true energy independent heating source: WOOD. I installed a modern, high-efficiency fireplace in the family room. Overall cost of my project was about $4300 - 30% tax credit = $3010. That was a self-install. That fall I cut enough firewood to last me 5-6 years. My current setup does rely on a small amount of electricity to circulate heat throughout the house, but even on a power outage we would still have heat, it just wouldn't get to the corners of the house as much. Here we are, mid-way through the 3rd season burning wood and I have a LOT of wood left. I may end up making it 7-8 years on the wood supply I cut all in 1 year. I truly believe the reason for that is two-fold. #1 heating source is inside. Outdoor boilers lose a lot of heat to the outside, indoors, any heat lost from the box is captured by my house. #2 EPA rated high-efficiency stoves make a huge difference in how much wood you burn. If you see somebody burning wood that has smoke coming out their chimney they are wasting energy. Smoke is unburned gas that was lost because they aren't burning in an efficient manner. The only time I ever have smoke coming out my chimney is right after I start a fire, before it's hot enough to burn the escaping gasses off efficiently.

The preparedness aspect of switching to wood heat was HUGE in my mind.

#1 It has been saving me $1500-2,000/yr in electrical expenses. That money can go towards other preps.
#2 Nobody/nothing can shut my heat off. If I own my house free & clear (not yet) and times get bad, I only have to pay my property taxes and I still still survive through an Indiana winter in my house.
#3 My heating source (one of the largest house-hold expenses in most northern states) is mostly independent from rising energy prices and energy shortages.
#4 In a long-term survival situation I can still heat my house without burning through precious resources like propane, gas, or electricity that I am acquiring by some alternative method. Those resources can be used where they will serve me much better like keeping a fridge/freezer going, providing transportation etc.
#5 If you have a wife, she will most likely love you for installing a fireplace for her. My wife loves to curl up on the floor in front of it and just soak in the heat. Cats and dogs love it too. Our dogs will lay right in front of it and pant because they are so hot but stay there because it feels so good.

Disclaimer: my wife initially hated the mess. No matter how careful you are, it's inevitable to get at least some dust and small bark pieces near/around the fireplace. She has become accustomed to it and she has learned to appreciate it.

 

[Krogo]

I'm sure I'm also late, however, +1 on the Kerosene.

I also have a 100% electric house. We have a Heatpump with no backup. We do not have room for a wood stove, and I refuse to install an outdoor boiler. Anytime the outside temperature drops below 20F we lose heat. We heat with Kerosene everyday in the winter and cook with it in the summer in our “Summer Kitchen.”
First and foremost, a salamander style heater should never, under any circumstances, be used in a living area!! Regardless of the fuel source. In what is written below, “Kerosene Heater” and “Propane Heater” will refer to Wicked Kerosene heaters and non vented portable Propane heaters.
There are several reasons for my decision to use Kerosene. Saftey, Storage, Use are key. Kerosene stores very well. If you treat it with a stabilizer like Pri-D it will store for an extremely long time (the PRI company says indefinitely with re-treatments however, I have my doubts.)

One complaint I hear is that Kerosene is expensive. Kerosene has an energy density of ~126,000 BTU per gallon. Current local cost (1/10/2013) for kerosene is $3.65 per gallon or $2.89 per 100,000 BTU. Propane has an energy density of ~91,000 BTU per gallon. A 20 pound Cylinder of propane contains ~4.5 gallons although that is based on a full tank, tanks are only filled to 80%. At the time of writing, Propane refills around here are $17.61 for a 20# tank (the Blue Rhino exchanges are around $22). So Propane is $3.91 per gallon or $4.29 per 100,000 BTU. The cost of Kerosene would have to increase to $5.40 per gallon to match the cost of propane in 20# tanks. The Wholesale cost of propane currently for those who have large permanent tanks is $1.925 per gallon or $2.11 per 100,000 BTU however that price does not include delivery. In summary: Kerosene is $2.89 / 100K BTU. Propane is $4.29 / 100K BTU (in 20# tanks)

So the next issue is storage of enough fuel for an emergency. I have two 10,000 BTU Radiant Kerosene Heaters. I can heat my home, comfortably, in a power outage in the dead of winter with both running. That’s 20,000 BTU per Hour. Lets assume that the heaters are 98% efficient (which most non vented heaters are) that means for 20,000 BTU of heat produced I’m using ~20,400 BTU worth of fuel per hour. Five gallons of Kerosene will theoretically heat my home continuously for 30 Hours. For the same heat load in propane, on a 20# tank, I’d theoretically get 20 hours runtime. So If I wanted to prepare for a full week of no power in the dead of winter, I’d have to store ~28 gallons of Kerosene or 37.8 Gallons of Propane. Six 5 gallon Kerosene cans or Nine 20# Propane tanks.

Kerosene is Combustible, NOT Flammable, Kerosene will not take a flame. Kerosene can be stored near ignition sources (although not advised.) The flash point (the point at which the liquid begins to “Flash” to a vapor) is above 100F whereas propane has a flash point of -155F. All this means that a leak of Kerosene will remain Combustible and pose no immediate fire risks whereas a Propane leak is Flammable at the get go and compounded by the fact that Propane is heavier than air.

All combustion consumes Oxygen, produces Carbon Dioxide and has the potential to create Carbon Monoxide. The potential to create CO is related to the oxygen concentration both in the surrounding air and the oxygen concentration at the source of combustion. As the levels of Oxygen decrease the potential to produce CO increase. Kerosene Heaters are not air regulated, meaning combustion has freely available all the oxygen required. The amount of fuel directly corresponds to the output. As long as oxygen levels are maintained in the area the heater is used and the heater is operated correctly, CO production should never be of concern, though I strongly recommend a CO detector in the area. Propane heaters must mix air and fuel to stoichiometry before proper combustion can occur. This means that if the oxygen levels in the area are low enough CO will be produced just like in the case of a Kerosene heater. Propane heaters however also have a mix tube or a burner design that regulates the amount of oxygen that is present for combustion. You now have two potential sources for CO production. If the Mix tube is partially clogged, or in the case of the Mr. Heater heaters there is dust on the Ceramic combustor or the tiny air passages in the combustor are partially blocked CO will be produced. The key to any non vented combustion heater is proper air exchange.

Take note of the UL rating on portable heaters. If you use a heater that is not UL rated for home use or Living area use and you home burns down because of it, Insurance may not pay out. Spend some time looking at the ratings on portable propane heaters. The HOSE may be UL listed but the heater is NOT. This may not be the case with all propane heaters, however the Mr. Heater Buddy series I hear many folks talking about is NOT UL certified. Almost all Wicked Kerosene heaters carry the UL certification.

Just because something stinks doesn't mean it’s bad!! I’m not sure when the country became stricken with chemophobia, I don’t like it though. The only time odor should be present when running a Kerosene heater is at startup and when you extinguish the heater. If you are experiencing odor while the unit is running, there is a problem. Kerosene Heaters really only have one setting, all out. If you run a Kerosene Heater with a low flame or a high flame you may get odor. The ideal setting for a Kerosene heater is where there are about ¼” to ½” BLUE flames poking out the top of the Catalyst/chimney. A Blue flame is a safe Flame. If you have any Yellow flames poking out the top you have incomplete combustion and are producing Odor at minimum CO worst case. Running a Kerosene heater on Low is always a recipe for odor. Remember I just said Catalyst? That’s because that’s what it is. If you run a heater on low, depending on the design, the catalyst will not be hot enough the promote complete combustion resulting in the release of “Flash” (remember that?.) The odor is unburned heavy hydrocarbons, maybe some aldehydes, etc....

Sizing is Key!! I have spoken to many folks that went out and bought a 23,000 BTU convection Kerosene heater and complained constantly about odor. Turns out, what was happening is they were either running it at low flame or constantly lighting and extinguishing it because they bought a heater far too large for the space. I Have a 1500 square foot ranch. On the coldest day of the year I need 20K BTU worth of heat to keep my house at 70F. When it’s between 10F and 20F I need 10K BTU. I have Two 10K radiant heaters. I will start a heater when I get home from work, at it stays running until the house hits 76F, with the furnace fan running to distribute the heat, or it’s time to go to bed. I have had numerous people visit and never know I was running a Kerosene heater until they saw it. As has been said already, heat the person not the air. That is why I only recommend Radiant Kerosene Heaters. Not only does it have the ability to warm the air, it warms everything within line of sight with radiant energy. You also don’t have to have the thing in the middle of the room like a convection. Mine are all against a wall, just like a piece of furniture.

Ok,, That was a little long!! I just wanted to distribute some facts. In the end, I don’t dismiss Propane as a viable heating option, I just chose not to utilize it.

 

[Sailor]

Small electric blanket uses 3-5 amps HR as the thermo cliks off and on during the night. Do the math on that with one marine battery.

Put that baby under some down, and its easy to stay warm.

Just a different approach at the problem.

 

[Small's]

That sounds good now just set up your tent in the inner most room in the house and cover it with blankets then you have a nice small insulated hut that is easy to heat and a toasty wam blanket

 

[pwoller]

In the past I put up blankets to block off areas of the house not needed and used a wood fireplace to heat the main room. We were nice and warm. Buddy heaters work well too and your supposed to be able to run them indoors.

 

[Sdixon]

You cant go wring with a good old fashioned woodstove. You can heat and cook with it. I have a LP gas fireplace too, but it is a PITA to use without electric.