Breaking: New Executive Actions to Reduce Gun Violence and Make Our Communities

[BogWalker]

As I said elsewhere, it's just writing a blank check to arrest.

 

[IndyDave1776]

As I said elsewhere, it's just writing a blank check to arrest.

Exactly. What better way to impose a de facto prohibition than to make it virtually impossible to stay within the law, no matter how unconstitutional it may be?

 

[Bfish]

The only REAL change I see here is getting rid of trusts.

I'll be super crappy if that happens I've got two cans I'm sending for in the next couple weeks and I need to do some sbrs like now. I've got to wait till the weekend though so we shall see!

It seemed like there would be restrictions imposed on them, not that they would get rid of them but who knows. I have always had to fill out a 4473 when picking up a can or anything, so I was confused about where they not needing a back ground check for it came from unless it's something with form 1's.

 

[indykid]

If we are going to be called dealers for selling off a couple of our prized possessions, will we need 4473s? Will we need dealer numbers? As firearm owners, should we bury AT and Unconstitutional F with requests for 4473 forms? That would melt the presses.

 

[Liberty Sanders]

I'm not losing a lot of sleep over this. The Republicans may respond by cutting ATF's funding to prevent implementation. In any case enforcement will be a train wreck. One thing it will do is saddle whoever is going to be the democratic candidate with the most motivated and pissed-off gun owning voters in decades.

It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Obama and Hillary between them don't add two million to NRA's membership rolls.

 

[Roland of Gilead]

These stood out.

Include information from the Social Security Administration in the background check system about beneficiaries who are prohibited from possessing a firearm.

Remove unnecessary legal barriers preventing States from reporting relevant information to the background check system. Although States generally report criminal history information to NICS, many continue to report little information about individuals who are prohibited by Federal law from possessing or receiving a gun for specific mental health reasons.

If you are taking anti-depressants, seeking counseling, collecting VA disability for PTSD, or are being treated for a mental health condition, SSA and HIPAA rules are streamlined to speed up reporting of this information to NCIS. Once that happens, no more gun ownership privileges for said owner. Then, who does the owner appeal to? How many hurdles and how much money will it cost the owner, to have their gun ownership rights restored?

P.S. Praise be to our ACA overlords who required that all our medical records be computerized!

People in West Virginia will be pissed. Huge numbers of people there collect SS disability for anxiety or something similar.

 

[DRob]

I agree with IndyGunWorks.

Thoughts on 230 new FBI hires. 1: Congress won't fund them. 2: Assuming #1 is wrong, it ain't happening overnight. It will take them 5 years to do the background checks on the applicants. 3: Our Pennsylvania Av. resident SFB knows this ain't gonna' fly. He just wants to be able to say those bad Republicans won't do what I tell them to. He may cry a little for the children.

I think this EO is stillborn but, if it doesn't get you out and voting for the Republican nominee, whoever it is, you are part of the problem!

 

[MRP2003]

I see that ultimately there will be a requirement that all guns sold whether through a dealer, at a gun show, or by individuals will require a back ground check. I am not personally against it as it MAY reduce the chances of guns being sold to people planning a terrorist attack.
If this goes through, the current FFLs may become the only place to buy or sell your guns which is BS.
I understand that this could become a slippery slope but we need something that is going to stop or reduce the number of mass shootings otherwise there will be more anti gun people then there are now. I have heard more and more people say ""they need to do something" where several years ago they did not think twice about people owning or carrying guns.
I do not think that any president will be able to take away our rights to own guns. Any real attempt would cause such a major disruption in our country that would cause enormous increase in crimes and a major decline in our economy. It would make the prohibition times seem like a party.
I do anticipate that as gun sales are extremely high now, they will continue to rise the rest of this year.
Things will only get worse if Clinton gets elected as I am sure she will abuse her power as she has always done.

 

[Huzrjim]

"In light of this, CBS News reports that Attorney General Loretta Lynch is making it known that the ATF will be watching and looking for private sellers who “seek to avoid registering” as being “engaged in the business of selling firearms.”


So will there be an ATF agent assigned to monitor every gun sale on the INGO classifieds? One for each state firearm forum that has classifieds? The Leviathan known as the Federal Government continues to grow...

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

Very unclear way of saying "don't break the law" and then giving no guidelines whatsoever to stay legal. Absolute Bull****.

 

[JTScribe]

This is great. When President Cruz decides to unilaterally stop ObamaCare and cut taxes for most earners, WTF can the left say? Hey, it's just an executive action . . .

 

[87iroc]

The ambiguity is my biggest problem. I want to sell my Mosin 91/30 here shortly. If I sell 1....is it a 'I'm in the bidness' or 'am I not'. Re-reading the txt.

No idea. The ATF 'Could' say because I 'manufacture' my own ammo that I'm in the business...

Its too wide open...but that's how they like it.

 

[2A_Tom]

Marked for reference.

 

[SteveM4A1]

I see that ultimately there will be a requirement that all guns sold whether through a dealer, at a gun show, or by individuals will require a back ground check. I am not personally against it as it MAY reduce the chances of guns being sold to people planning a terrorist attack.
If this goes through, the current FFLs may become the only place to buy or sell your guns which is BS.
I understand that this could become a slippery slope but we need something that is going to stop or reduce the number of mass shootings otherwise there will be more anti gun people then there are now. I have heard more and more people say ""they need to do something" where several years ago they did not think twice about people owning or carrying guns.
I do not think that any president will be able to take away our rights to own guns. Any real attempt would cause such a major disruption in our country that would cause enormous increase in crimes and a major decline in our economy. It would make the prohibition times seem like a party.
I do anticipate that as gun sales are extremely high now, they will continue to rise the rest of this year.
Things will only get worse if Clinton gets elected as I am sure she will abuse her power as she has always done.

Why would a person that is focused on doing harm follow the law and get a background check when they don't have to? I believe you need to rethink your position.

 

[eldirector]

Well, at least he is DOING something.

They way I read this, other than spending millions of dollars hiring a bunch of new Federal employees (which may actually speed up the NICS check, yea!), there is really no change. He is directing Federal agencies to do what they are already supposed to be doing. Whoop-te-do-da-day.

I appreciate the allotment for mental health care. Though, $500M at the Federal level isn't really going to do much of anything at all.

Will be interesting to watch HIPAA bump heads with this EA. It would be pretty funny for some Federal agencies to get nailed with HIPAA violations.

I'll re-read and see if I missed anything. So far, though, mostly hot air. Actually... luke warm at best.

 

[seedubs1]

If you don't think they're already monitoring this forum, you're sadly mistaken.

"In light of this, CBS News reports that Attorney General Loretta Lynch is making it known that the ATF will be watching and looking for private sellers who “seek to avoid registering” as being “engaged in the business of selling firearms.”


So will there be an ATF agent assigned to monitor every gun sale on the INGO classifieds? One for each state firearm forum that has classifieds? The Leviathan known as the Federal Government continues to grow...

 

[2A_Tom]

I see that ultimately there will be a requirement that all guns sold whether through a dealer, at a gun show, or by individuals will require a back ground check. I am not personally against it as it MAY reduce the chances of guns being sold to people planning a terrorist attack.
If this goes through, the current FFLs may become the only place to buy or sell your guns which is BS.
I understand that this could become a slippery slope but we need something that is going to stop or reduce the number of mass shootings otherwise there will be more anti gun people then there are now. I have heard more and more people say ""they need to do something" where several years ago they did not think twice about people owning or carrying guns.
I do not think that any president will be able to take away our rights to own guns. Any real attempt would cause such a major disruption in our country that would cause enormous increase in crimes and a major decline in our economy. It would make the prohibition times seem like a party.
I do anticipate that as gun sales are extremely high now, they will continue to rise the rest of this year.
Things will only get worse if Clinton gets elected as I am sure she will abuse her power as she has always done.

Why would a person that is focused on doing harm follow the law and get a background check when they don't have to? I believe you need to rethink your position.

It seems that the more of these incidents there are the more our numbers are increasing. More Americans believe that the 2nd is more important than gun control than before Obie was elected. More guns are being sold now than then.

 

[Rocketscientist]

The ambiguity is my biggest problem. I want to sell my Mosin 91/30 here shortly. If I sell 1....is it a 'I'm in the bidness' or 'am I not'. Re-reading the txt.

No idea. The ATF 'Could' say because I 'manufacture' my own ammo that I'm in the business...

Its too wide open...but that's how they like it.

Totally agree. Their idea of clarifying the meaning of "in the business" offers zero clarity. In other words, stick to FTF cash deals only with people you know, and do the deal between 4 walls and a roof instead of out in an open parking lot, and nobody is the wiser. There would be no real proof you did anything and no way to track it. Same as it is now.

Now my next issue which is a question for lawyers: Does an online advertisement constitute proof of ownership and/or proof of possession of the item being advertised?

Lets say I post a random picture of a Lamborghini for sale on Craigslist for a million bucks. It doesn't prove that I am the owner, nor does it make me a car dealer. Furthermore, there is no proof that I ever owned the car. When someone comes to buy it, I say "sorry, it's already sold." Still no proof that I actually sold anything. At most, I could be accused of lying since I made it all up.

I just don't see how an online advertisement offers proof of anything. Merchants do that crap all the time. Advertise something, and then when you go to buy it, they're out of stock, which means the merchant does not own, nor is in possession of the item they are selling.

That being said, unless you sold directly to, or within sight of an ATF agent, how would they make a gun dealing charge stick based on an online advertisement?

 

[printcraft]

“ATF will make clear that whether you are ‘engaged in the business’ depends on the facts and circumstances,” Jarrett said. “On factors such as: whether you represent yourself as a dealer, such as making business cards or taking credit card statements. Whether you sell firearms shortly after they’re acquired or whether you buy or sell in the original packaging.”

What do those *******s have against business cards!!

Business cards are scary features, much like the dreaded shoulder thing that goes up.

 

[Bennettjh]

What do those *******s have against business cards!!

Business cards are scary features, much like the dreaded shoulder thing that goes up.