Arizona Governor vetoes discrimination bill

[MisterChester]

Arizona governor vetoes religious freedom bill - 13 WTHR Indianapolis

So INGO, what do you think?

 

[SSGSAD]

According to WISH TV, 8 in Indy, they were "threatened" to lose the Super Bowl .....

 

[zippy23]

another fail for the republicans. They failed to protect the people from the insanity of liberalism. Its a clear message that businesses cant conduct business how they want. If they want to lose business thats their choice. A business should not be forced to serve people that they flat out disagree with or if it violates their faith. religious liberties in this country are going down the toilet, while a tiny minority of gays go insane over a wedding cake. The majority is laying down while the minority rips the country apart. Pathetic, she did some great stuff in her time as governor. This is one of the bad ones, she caved, just as the rest of the republicans do when the media spotlight is on them. terrible.

 

[ghostdncr]

I think the right should keep promoting these kinds of hate bills so that my stock of AR15's and AK's will be worth about $2000 each immediately following the mid-term elections and I can just buy Barbados outright and retire there.

The Dems preach inclusion for everyone EXCEPT gun owners and religious fanatics and just keep on winning elections. The GOP keeps attacking everyone EXCEPT gun owners and religious fanatics and just keep on losing elections. I can't imagine why!

I guess we all have our bellwether political issues, though. Mine happens to be anything concerning the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America, which I took an oath to defend. I'm kinda passionate about that. If yours happens to be something two adults are doing in the privacy of their own bedroom, well, rock on and good luck with your fiddling while the Republic burns, I suppose.

 

[deal me in]

At least they're being consistent. If I own a business and I can't discriminate against blacks, women, or disabled people, I shouldn't be able to discriminate against gays either. I don't know what religious freedom has to do with any of it, it's about property rights. I'm a libertarian, so I don't believe in any gov't protected classes, but if you're going to protect gender, race, etc, it makes sense to protect sexual orientation as well. The thing they all have in common is that people are born that way, they don't choose to be female, black, disabled, or gay.

 

[poptab]

At least they're being consistent. If I own a business and I can't discriminate against blacks, women, or disabled people, I shouldn't be able to discriminate against gays either. I don't know what religious freedom has to do with any of it, it's about property rights. I'm a libertarian, so I don't believe in any gov't protected classes, but if you're going to protect gender, race, etc, it makes sense to protect sexual orientation as well. The thing they all have in common is that people are born that way, they don't choose to be female, black, disabled, or gay.

I'm pretty sure you can choose to be gay, female, or disabled.

 

[IndyGal65]

another fail for the republicans. They failed to protect the people from the insanity of liberalism. Its a clear message that businesses cant conduct business how they want. If they want to lose business thats their choice. A business should not be forced to serve people that they flat out disagree with or if it violates their faith. religious liberties in this country are going down the toilet, while a tiny minority of gays go insane over a wedding cake. The majority is laying down while the minority rips the country apart. Pathetic, she did some great stuff in her time as governor. This is one of the bad ones, she caved, just as the rest of the republicans do when the media spotlight is on them. terrible.

Personally, if someone refused to make my cake or take photographs for our wedding, I would simply go elsewhere. I'd be pissed, but I'd go elsewhere. Hell, I would make sure the companies I wanted to use were gay friendly to begin with. I prefer to support companies that recognize equality for all. Having said that, I believe the governor made the right call. IMO, this whole "religious liberty" campaign is merely a cloak for discrimination. What if a gay person/couple is standing in line to pay for their groceries and are turned away because the owner doesn't like their ilk? What if they go to a restaurant but are refused service? Or a movie theater? A vacation spot? Where does this crap end??

 

[Bunnykid68]

Should a black baker be forced to make a cake for the Grand Dragon of the KKK with KKK and swasticas on it

So, gay owned businesses should also be forced to work with say, the Westboro Baptist Church..

 

[deal me in]

I'm pretty sure you can choose to be gay, female, or disabled.

You can't choose to be gay or female. I guess you could choose to be disabled, but i don't think it happens often enough to bring it up. Having a sex change operation doesn't make you female, you still have the male chromosomes. If you think that one can choose to be gay, test it by making that choice for yourself and see how it works out. You can choose to engage in gay sex acts, but you can't choose to be gay.

 

[rambone]

What if a gay person/couple is standing in line to pay for their groceries and are turned away because the owner doesn't like their ilk? What if they go to a restaurant but are refused service? Or a movie theater? A vacation spot? Where does this crap end??

Freedom means transactions should be voluntary by both parties. When you are coerced to do business against your will you have given away freedom in order to achieve convenience or artificial inclusion. Discrimination is ugly sometimes but it is a part of being free.

Besides, why would someone want to give their money to a business that hates them? Let the haters expose themselves and make themselves known. Better than let them hide behind a feel-good law and spit in your food in secret.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Call me crazy, but I think I see a workable, Libertarian style solution. Allow them to refuse service... ON ONE CONDITION: They must post conspicuously that they will refuse service. This would apply to every web page on their site, as well as their front door, and any advertisements they produce. (Failure do to so would result in charges/stiff penalties if they decided to discriminate.)

If they want to refuse service, they need to wear it like a badge of "honor" for the entire world to see. That way those that are tolerant but not affected (like me) could vote with their feet and take their business elsewhere. If they want freedoms, they should be forced to take the loss of business that goes along with it by losing those customers that disagree with them. (no [STRIKE]guns[/STRIKE] gays, no money cards?)

 

[Cameramonkey]

You can't choose to be gay or female. I guess you could choose to be disabled, but i don't think it happens often enough to bring it up. Having a sex change operation doesn't make you female, you still have the male chromosomes. If you think that one can choose to be gay, test it by making that choice for yourself and see how it works out. You can choose to engage in gay sex acts, but you can't choose to be gay.

Im pretty sure thats an obvious typo... otherwise how on earth could you choose to be female or disabled?

 

[IndyGal65]

Freedom means transactions should be voluntary by both parties. When you are coerced to do business against your will you have given away freedom in order to achieve convenience or artificial inclusion. Discrimination is ugly sometimes but it is a part of being free.

Besides, why would someone want to give their money to a business that hates them? Let the haters expose themselves and make themselves known. Better than let them hide behind a feel-good law and spit in your food in secret.

I get what you are saying, and as I said in my post, I prefer to give my money to businesses that believe in equality for all. I would choose the butcher, the baker, and candlestick maker that welcomes my business. But, hypothetically, say we are visiting Arizona and stop in the local mom n pop store to get some snacks. First, because we don't always leave the house with our "I'm with my lesbian lover---->" shirts on, how would they even know to not sell to us? Are business going to be allowed to put up signs stating "Straight Only?" What if we're in the middle of BFE and need to use the restroom..."I'm sorry, but my religious beliefs prevent you from using the loo." Silly examples, perhaps, but not that far of a stretch. What happened to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? I guess it only suits some when they feel like it.

 

[rambone]

Call me crazy, but I think I see a workable, Libertarian style solution. Allow them to refuse service... ON ONE CONDITION: They must post conspicuously that they will refuse service. This would apply to every web page on their site, as well as their front door, and any advertisements they produce. (Failure do to so would result in charges/stiff penalties if they decided to discriminate.)

If they want to refuse service, they need to wear it like a badge of "honor" for the entire world to see. That way those that are tolerant but not affected (like me) could vote with their feet and take their business elsewhere. If they want freedoms, they should be forced to take the loss of business that goes along with it by losing those customers that disagree with them. (no [STRIKE]guns[/STRIKE] gays, no money cards?)

Sounds like a lot of government coercion to make this happen.

 

[Trooper]

Ok, is it now legal for a homosexual couple to force a Christian baker to make a cake in the shape of phallus? Or a cake down from a picture of the couple having sex?

What about Faith McGregor Sues Omar Mahrouk, Muslim Barber, For Refusing To Cut Her Hair
Faith McGregor Sues Omar Mahrouk, Muslim Barber, For Refusing To Cut Her Hair

Does this give gays the ultimate right to force others to submit to them as they are the ultimate victims?

 

[ryknoll3]

I think the right should keep promoting these kinds of hate bills so that my stock of AR15's and AK's will be worth about $2000 each immediately following the mid-term elections and I can just buy Barbados outright and retire there.

The Dems preach inclusion for everyone EXCEPT gun owners and religious fanatics and just keep on winning elections. The GOP keeps attacking everyone EXCEPT gun owners and religious fanatics and just keep on losing elections. I can't imagine why!

I guess we all have our bellwether political issues, though. Mine happens to be anything concerning the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America, which I took an oath to defend. I'm kinda passionate about that. If yours happens to be something two adults are doing in the privacy of their own bedroom, well, rock on and good luck with your fiddling while the Republic burns, I suppose.

I think being forced to go to their wedding to take pictures of it or bake a cake for it or cater it, etc.... goes beyond "something two adults are doing in the privacy of their own bedroom."

I personally don't think that government should be in the business of deciding what constitutes marriage, or forcing parties to involuntarily engage in commercial transactions. When it comes your your relationship with government, everyone should be treated equally. When it comes to the interaction of private parties, they should be able to associate and commerce with whomever they wish, and let the market and society determine if their business model is welcome.

 

[caverjamie]

Well I guess now the baker has to make the cake, but how long until someone gets sued for discrimination because the cake "didn't taste right"

 

[Bunnykid68]

I get what you are saying, and as I said in my post, I prefer to give my money to businesses that believe in equality for all. I would choose the butcher, the baker, and candlestick maker that welcomes my business. But, hypothetically, say we are visiting Arizona and stop in the local mom n pop store to get some snacks. First, because we don't always leave the house with our "I'm with my lesbian lover---->" shirts on, how would they even know to not sell to us? Are business going to be allowed to put up signs stating "Straight Only?" What if we're in the middle of BFE and need to use the restroom..."I'm sorry, but my religious beliefs prevent you from using the loo." Silly examples, perhaps, but not that far of a stretch. What happened to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? I guess it only suits some when they feel like it.

Your life, liberty and pursuit of happiness stops at my doorstep so to speak

Especially depending on what you are doing on my doorstep. I may have you removed.

 

[Trooper]

Should a black baker be forced to make a cake for the Grand Dragon of the KKK with KKK and swasticas on it

So, gay owned businesses should also be forced to work with say, the Westboro Baptist Church..

A gay bar in LA forbids anyone who disagrees with them from being served.
West Hollywood gay bar bans lawmakers deemed anti-gay - latimes.com

 

[IndyGal65]

Ok, is it now legal for a homosexual couple to force a Christian baker to make a cake in the shape of phallus? Or a cake down from a picture of the couple having sex?s?

Really? Yes, because I'm sure that is just rampant. Would a Christian baker do those things for a straight couple?