Another bombing, this time at a school. Suspect caught!

[lucky4034]

How do we know this 16 year old girl knew she was breaking the law? People break laws that they do not know exist all the time and a few officers have enforced laws that do not exists.

Ignorance is not excuse for the law... but I suppose she could have been too stupid to know that causing an explosion in school is against the law.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Ignorance is not excuse for the law... but I suppose she could have been too stupid to know that causing an explosion in school is against the law.

When did you turn into a 'lock 'em up and throw away the key' advocate? We have a youngster who made an admittedly bad choice, most likely without considering that it was anything approaching this serious so far as the impending official reaction. One would think that any reasonable definition of an explosive or destructive device is that it must explode and be destructive. Further, people engaging in an act with wrongful intent generally don't just stand around afterward.

The bottom line before stacking multiple felonies on this girl is the answer to one simple question: What harm was done? So far as I can tell, no one was harmed in terms of injury or property destruction with the potential exception of cleaning up the mess. In the worst case scenario, she may rightfully owe the school compensation for the custodian's time cleaning up the mess.

Expecting teenagers to think like 40 year old lawyers is just plain stupid.

 

[lucky4034]

Do you know the difference between detonation, deflagration, and simply bursting under pressure?

In terms of the law? No... I'm not familiar with what the law says regarding the intentionally setting off of an explosive.

My guess is that they lump the action all in together. While you may be able to differentiate between them... the result is the still the same.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Do you know the difference between detonation, deflagration, and simply bursting under pressure?

Beat me to it.

 

[lucky4034]

When did you turn into a 'lock 'em up and throw away the key' advocate?

I didn't... and she hasn't had her day in court yet.

I don't feel sorry that she committed crimes and has been charged as such. I don't think its an over reach of the law to make an arrest for these crimes. Whether it was necessary is a different debate.

I have also previously stated that she will get her day in court and hopefully the court system doesn't fail her and doesn't ruin her life. That would be tragic and an over reaction. If that happens, then I will have sympathy for her....

As of right now, I see no reason to feel sorry for her.

 

[lucky4034]

Beat me to it.

Are you saying that these types of devices don't detonate?

 

[jbombelli]

Are you saying that these types of devices don't detonate?

That is correct. These types of devices do not detonate. They simply burst under pressure. Detonation is a specific type of reaction that involves a supersonic exothermic shockwave traveling through the explosive material. Think C-4.

Deflagration involves a subsonic exothermic reaction (i.e. burning really fast) - think black powder.

Devices like the one in this story are simply overpressure devices - they do not detonate OR deflagrate. They simply build pressure and burst.


The term "detonate" is very commonly misused in this regard. Unfortunate, but there you go.

 

[IndyDave1776]

I didn't... and she hasn't had her day in court yet.

I don't feel sorry that she committed crimes and has been charged as such. I don't think its an over reach of the law to make an arrest for these crimes. Whether it was necessary is a different debate.

I have also previously stated that she will get her day in court and hopefully the court system doesn't fail her and doesn't ruin her life. That would be tragic and an over reaction. If that happens, then I will have sympathy for her....

As of right now, I see no reason to feel sorry for her.

What is the point in filing some of the stupidest charges I have heard of in ages and dragging a kid into court over something patently stupid. This is a major part of the reason why I am satisfied that much of the so-called criminal justice system is surplus to our needs. A stern lecture from the principal should be sufficient. A few days at home to reflect on the matter should be more than sufficient. Felony charges? Get real.

 

[lucky4034]

That is correct. These types of devices do not detonate. They simply burst under pressure. Detonation is a specific type of reaction that involves a supersonic exothermic shockwave traveling through the explosive material. Think C-4.

Deflagration involves a subsonic exothermic reaction (i.e. burning really fast) - think black powder.

Devices like the one in this story are simply overpressure devices - they do not detonate OR deflagrate. They simply build pressure and burst.


The term "detonate" is very commonly misused in this regard. Unfortunate, but there you go.

Incorrect... devices like these are exothermic reactions inside a closed system that produce a shock wave.

Ergo... detonation

 

[lucky4034]

What is the point in filing some of the stupidest charges I have heard of in ages and dragging a kid into court over something patently stupid. This is a major part of the reason why I am satisfied that much of the so-called criminal justice system is surplus to our needs. A stern lecture from the principal should be sufficient. A few days at home to reflect on the matter should be more than sufficient. Felony charges? Get real.

And had this thing blown off someones hand or a blinded some kid? It isn't the destruction that she is being charged with... it is the action.

Would I cry if she got exactly what you propose? No... a strong talking to from the principle and expulsion may do the trick.

 

[JeremiahJohnson]

Good thing I'm not a student now. Guess I'd be a felon for turning the biology room purple...or filling the principles car with packing peanuts...or having my shotgun in the car to hunt rabbits with my science teacher...or any of a dozen other things I can think of.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Lucky, you certainly aren't the person I thought you were. You are advocating a full scale felony prosecution of a kid who did something stupid and should be treated like a kid who did something stupid and not a terrorist.

 

[IndyDave1776]

And had this thing blown off someones hand or a blinded some kid? It isn't the destruction that she is being charged with... it is the action.

Would I cry if she got exactly what you propose? No... a strong talking to from the principle and expulsion may do the trick.

You can 'what if' indefinitely. The bottom line is that no harm was caused. I could run over people every time I drive. I could catch something on fire when using a torch, grinder, or saw. I could have an accidental discharge when carrying a gun. The bottom line is that basing laws and punishment on 'pre-crime' or what 'could' happen just doesn't work for a number of reasons.

 

[jbombelli]

Incorrect... devices like these are exothermic reactions inside a closed system that produce a shock wave.

Ergo... detonation

sigh.

Simply put, you are wrong. I'm not going to get into all of the chemistry here, but you are wrong. When it comes to explosives and chemistry, you are simply wrong.

This was a simple overpressure device, not a detonation.

 

[Westside]

Detonate | Define Detonate at Dictionary.com

detonate

  Use Detonate in a sentence
det·o·nate

[det-n-eyt] Show IPA verb, det·o·nat·ed, det·o·nat·ing.
verb (used without object) 1. to explode with suddenness and violence.


verb (used with object) 2. to cause (something explosive) to explode.

Explode | Define Explode at Dictionary.com

explode

  Use Explode in a sentence
ex·plode

[ik-splohd] Show IPA verb, ex·plod·ed, ex·plod·ing.
verb (used without object) 1. to expand with force and noise because of rapid chemical change or decomposition, as gunpowder or nitroglycerine ( opposed to implode ).

2. to burst, fly into pieces, or break up violently with a loud report, as a boiler from excessive pressure of steam.

3. to burst forth violently or emotionally, especially with noise, laughter, violent speech, etc.: He exploded with rage when contradicted.

4. Phonetics . (of plosives) to terminate the occlusive phase with a plosion. Compare implode ( def 2 ) .

5. Golf. to play an explosion shot on a golf ball.

 

[lucky4034]

You can 'what if' indefinitely. The bottom line is that no harm was caused. I could run over people every time I drive. I could catch something on fire when using a torch, grinder, or saw. I could have an accidental discharge when carrying a gun. The bottom line is that basing laws and punishment on 'pre-crime' or what 'could' happen just doesn't work for a number of reasons.

Then complain about the law... not that it was applied. I don't think smoking pot should be illegal, but I'm not going to complain if I get arrested doing it.

Regardless if you don't like it or not... the little girl broke the law. She made an explosive device in a school and set it off.

The "terrorist" that had a bomb in his shoe didn't do any damage either....

How can anyone complain that she has been arrested for breaking an established law? Is it excessive? Maybe so.... Exploding something in a school isn't a prank. Her intentions were to cause an explosion... not to create purple smoke or to make the building smell funny... but ONLY to explode something.

 

[IndyDave1776]

It would do to keep in mind that for the purpose at hand, the technical usage of the word(s) is in order rather than common usage which is far less precise or correct.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Then complain about the law... not that it was applied. I don't think smoking pot should be illegal, but I'm not going to complain if I get arrested doing it.

Regardless if you don't like it or not... the little girl broke the law. She made an explosive device in a school and set it off.

The "terrorist" that had a bomb in his shoe didn't do any damage either....

How can anyone complain that she has been arrested for breaking an established law? Is it excessive? Maybe so.... Exploding something in a school isn't a prank. Her intentions were to cause an explosion... not to create purple smoke or to make the building smell funny... but ONLY to explode something.

You have just run headlong into one of my pet issues. We have been sold a huge collection of horse**** laws on the notion that they are intended for use only on a dangerous subset of criminals (much in the same way we were sold asset forfeiture laws) and in practice they are used on anyone who can be shoehorned into fitting the description no matter how asinine the accusation may in fact be.

The 'shoe bomber' by contrast can be demonstrated to have had intent to harm others, his failure to do so notwithstanding.

 

[lucky4034]

sigh.

Simply put, you are wrong. I'm not going to get into all of the chemistry here, but you are wrong. When it comes to explosives and chemistry, you are simply wrong.

This was a simple overpressure device, not a detonation.

Please do... I've got plenty of background in chemistry I can handle it. I'd love to see you use chemistry to describe a "simple over-pressure device".

 

[lucky4034]

You have just run headlong into one of my pet issues. We have been sold a huge collection of horse**** laws on the notion that they are intended for use only on a dangerous subset of criminals (much in the same way we were sold asset forfeiture laws) and in practice they are used on anyone who can be shoehorned into fitting the description no matter how asinine the accusation may in fact be.

The 'shoe bomber' by contrast can be demonstrated to have had intent to harm others, his failure to do so notwithstanding.

And where is your evidence that this 16 yo didn't have any intent to harm anyone or destroy property?