9 states now threatening to remove obama from their ballots

[rcuhljr]

I see. At first I took it to be a lawsuit from the state against Obama.

Yeah I was surprised as well until I saw someone else in the thread clarify it.

 

[Episcopus]

also, pet peeve of mine, but to the person who said this country was founded as a christian nation, most of the founding fathers where either influenced by deistic thought or were actually published deists. >.>

The First Amendment makes it clear that this is NOT a Christian nation. This is a secular nation. The Nation has no business being associated with any religion. The majority of the people in the nation may be Christian, but that doesn't mean that religion should have anything to do with running or shaping the nation.

 

[BloodEclipse]

The Snopes Page does not answer the question of Obama being a citizen of Indonesia. Indonesia does not allow for dual citizenship so to be a citizen he would have had to give up his US or Kenyan citizenship. Once you give up a US citizenship you have to apply all over again and become naturalized and that disqualifies you from being President. Obama traveled the Middle East and Africa with an Indonesian passport in the 80's. It seems simple enough to me, if he has nothing to hide why fight? Why not just put the rumor to rest. If it is just that?

 

[Prometheus]

The First Amendment makes it clear that this is NOT a Christian nation. This is a secular nation. The Nation has no business being associated with any religion. The majority of the people in the nation may be Christian, but that doesn't mean that religion should have anything to do with running or shaping the nation.

I don't know what First Amendment you are reading, but the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America makes it clear the government is not to IMPOSE any religion upon the People. That is a far cry from making it pro or anti religion.

The First Amendment is very clear. Shall make NO LAWS. In either direction.

This is for another topic however.

 

[Episcopus]

This is for another topic however.

Yes it is.

 

[finity]

By the way this is a Christian nation and not that of Islam.

So the Second Amendment is important but we can just flush the First down the toilet?

I think you need to brush up on the Constitution & the history of the major Founding Fathers (you know the ones who wrote &/or shaped the Constitution).

Here you go. These will get you started:


"Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we called it the word of a demon, than the word of God. It is a history of wickedness, that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind." [SIZE=-1]- Thomas Paine [/SIZE][SIZE=-2](The Age of Reason, 1794-1795.)[/SIZE]

Every man "ought to be protected in worshipping the Deity according to the dictates of his own conscience." [SIZE=-1]- George Washington [/SIZE][SIZE=-2](Letter to the United Baptist Churches in Virginia in May, 1789)[/SIZE]

"Question with boldness even the existence of a god." [SIZE=-1]- Thomas Jefferson[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2](letter to Peter Carr, 10 August 1787)[/SIZE]

"When a Religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its Professors are obliged to call for help of the Civil Power, it is a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one." [SIZE=-1]- Benjamin Franklin[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2](from a letter to Richard Price, October 9, 1780[/SIZE]

I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of... Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."[SIZE=-1]- Thomas Paine[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2](The Age of Reason, 1794-1795.)[/SIZE]

"Is uniformity attainable? Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error
all over the earth." [SIZE=-1]- Thomas Jefferson [/SIZE][SIZE=-2](Notes on Virginia, 1782; from George Seldes, ed., The Great Quotations, Secaucus, New Jersey: Citadel Press, 1983, p. 363.)[/SIZE]

"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." [SIZE=-1]- James Madison[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2](Memorial and Remonstrance against Religious Assessments, 1785.)[/SIZE]

"Where do we find a precept in the Bible for Creeds, Confessions, Doctrines and Oaths, and whole carloads of other trumpery that we find religion encumbered with in these days?" [SIZE=-1]- John Adams[/SIZE]

"The civil rights of none shall be abridged on account of religious belief or worship, nor shall any national religion be established, nor shall the full and equal rights of conscience be in any manner, or on any pretence, infringed.'' [SIZE=-1]- James Madison[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2](Original wording of the First Amendment; Annals of Congress 434 (June 8, 1789).)[/SIZE]

"As the Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries." [SIZE=-2]- (Treaty of Tripoli, 1797 - signed by President John Adams.)[/SIZE]

Also see Treaty of Tripoli

"As to religion, I hold it to be the indispensable duty of government to protect all conscientious protesters thereof, and I know of no other business government has to do therewith." [SIZE=-1]- Thomas Paine [/SIZE][SIZE=-2](Common Sense, 1776.)[/SIZE]

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations." [SIZE=-1]- Patrick Henry[/SIZE]
"That religion, or the duty we owe to our Creator, and the manner of discharging it, can be directed only by reason and conviction, not by force or violence; and therefore all men are equally entitled to the free exercise of religion, according to the dictates of conscience." [SIZE=-1]- Patrick Henry[/SIZE] [SIZE=-2](Virginia Bill of Rights, June 12, 1776.)[/SIZE]

I can find you more if those aren't enough.

No one is denying the fact that the Founders were religious, just that this country was founded as a Christian one.

 

[elaw555]

It seems to me that this country was founded on Christian morals, but not as a Christian country.

Our founders, as it says above, were concerned that religious persecution, which happened to them, would not happen here. Therefore we now have religions that believe that little green men will eventually come and get them, etc. etc.

But it is clear that Christianity was the basic go-to, when the laws of the nation were being discussed and written down. It was the moral background our founding fathers had to use to shape the early policies and laws.

The question of separation of Church and State has always applied to ensuring our government does not declare any one religion the official state religion and persecute those that do not follow the religion. It does not, and should not, apply to religious sayings on currency, religious monuments in state/federal buildings, or the saying of prayers anywhere. It is simple probability (majority of Americans are Christian so Presidents are much more likely to be Christian) that we haven't had a non-Christian president...yet.

 

[indykid]

And this thread was started why???

 

[Episcopus]

And this thread was started why???

Start on page 1, it will probably tell you

Edit: I see that you made posts on page 1, so ignore my snark.

 

[indykid]

Don't you love two threads for the price of one?

 

[Episcopus]

Don't you love two threads for the price of one?

Save's time, I guess.

 

[VN Vet]

Remember when JFK was running for President. He was a Catholic, Oh my, said many Protestants. How can we have a Catholic in the Oval Office? Well we did.

There are good Muslims and bad Muslims just like people in every religion. I'd be more concerned which one he is. You can't tell just by looking. We will find out if he is elected. BO is a "member" of the United Church of Christ which should make him a Christain. I was too was a life long member of the UCC until they kicked me out in 1988. All I did was stop giving them money because of their ultra liberal ways.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Remember when JFK was running for President. He was a Catholic, Oh my, said many Protestants. How can we have a Catholic in the Oval Office? Well we did.

There are good Muslims and bad Muslims just like people in every religion. I'd be more concerned which one he is. You can't tell just by looking. We will find out if he is elected. BO is a "member" of the United Church of Christ which should make him a Christain. I was too was a life long member of the UCC until they kicked me out in 1988. All I did was stop giving them money because of their ultra liberal ways.

I don't really care if he IS a Muslim. In and of itself, that's not a disqualifier to me. I DO care that he's a lying socialist parasite scum who wants to **** and **** all over MY country and MY Constitution.

Hmm. Sounds like the last "President" we had, you know, the one before the guy that's in office right now.

Blessings,
B

 

[4sarge]

I don't really care if he IS a Muslim. In and of itself, that's not a disqualifier to me. I DO care that he's a lying socialist parasite scum who wants to **** and **** all over MY country and MY Constitution.

Hmm. Sounds like the last "President" we had, you know, the one before the guy that's in office right now.

Blessings,
B

Rep for the Truth

 

[dburkhead]